Interview with Raymond Levy, October 30, 1991

Betty Bronner:

Good evening, this is Betty Bronner. I'm taping for our Jewish Community Center family history project, and this evening I have the pleasure of presenting Raymond Levy.

Raymond Levy:

[My cousins 00:00:13]

B.B.:

Mr. Levy, would you please give us your name, your address, and if you care to, your phone number.

R.L.:

Please don't refer to me as Mr. Levy. My name is Raymond Marcus Levy. My address is 2536 Broad Leaf Rd, Louisville, Kentucky, 40205. My phone number is 452-1263. Now, I has the easiest man in Louisville to get in touch with, so I've got several other numbers if you need those, but I'll refrain from doing that at this moment.

B.B.:

Oh, thank you very much [laughing 00:01:00]. Mr. Levy, Raymond, would you tell 1:00us your birthday and then let's talk about your parents and how your original antecedents came to the United States and where they came to.

R.L.:

Originally- well, first of all, what- my birthday you want?

B.B.:

If you please.

R.L.:

Alright, my birthday is July, 21st 1925. I'm a first generation American. My father Isadore Levy, better known as Ytsock Orsvosky Levy. He changed his name to Isadore because he was- there was a time where there was an outbreak of the cholera epidemic in Lithuania back around the 1901 or 1902 and my father, in 2:00order to... there was an old Jewish custom that during an illness, in order to shy away the death- the angel of death, you changed the name, so he can go get somebody else.

B.B.:

That's great.

R.L.:

Now, my father was asked to leave this little stable in Lithuania called the Vilna and he was asked by the Jon Doms... it often reminds when I see Fiddler on the Roof about the cossack or the man from the- the policeman coming in and telling Tevye "Tevye we're going to have a little disturbance here today. It won't be too serious, but we just want to show them that in the capital that 3:00we're taking care of things." My father got together with a bunch of boys. He was about 14 or 15 years old. And at that time they, there was the very first beginning of some of the evil in Lithuania. These boys went out and absolutely blew up a train. Now, how 14, 15 year olds can come about doing those things, it's something I can't imagine. But my dad was about 14 or 15 at the time, as I said.

R.L.:

And so, the policeman came to my grandparents Esther and Eudel and they suggested that Isadore, or Ytsock at that time, leave as soon as possible. Like 4:00now. And so dad left Vilna about 1908 or 1909 because it was during the Roosevelt administration. Teddy Roosevelt's administration. And he arrived in New York and came directly to Columbus, Ohio to an ant and uncle.

B.B.:

Do you know their names?

R.L.:

I believe, I'm not sure, but I think the last name of the uncle was [Desdine 00:04:34] or something like that name. Yes, [inaudible 00:04:37], Betty?

B.B.:

I think so.

R.L.:

Okay. But anyway, Desdine and my father stayed around Columbus for a while.

B.B.:

What did he do there?

R.L.:

I don't know what he did there. But then he came on to- came down to Kentucky because he had family in Mount Sterling, also, the Markofskys, which became Bush 5:00Macy's family. And Markofsky was a brother or-

B.B.:

Sister.

R.L.:

Markofsky's wife was Esther Desdine's sister. And so my father came on to Mount Sterling, Kentucky. And this, as I said, was about 1906. And dad rode- he started working and buying furs and stuff like that as a trader. He used to ride up in the mountains of Eastern Kentucky buying furs and ginseng. Ginseng was a very - as it is today - a very important herb, a root, and very expensive. And they made- they shipped it to China to be used for medicinal purposes. And it 6:00was very popular in that day. But then, father went- I mean my dad, I don't call him father- my dad went on to, and around Mount Sterling, Winchester, and Richmond, Kentucky. He got over to Lexington a little bit but not much. He really stayed around Richmond, Mount Sterling, and Winchester.

R.L.:

And for some reason or another he went back home about 1912 or 1913, at the outbreak of World War I and- in Europe. And he proceeded to get his brother, both brothers, and the grandparents. He sent them on back to America. He got 7:00back here sometime around, I think about 1914 or 1915. And so, my dad had Uncle Nat - that's Betty's father - then Uncle Haim. And Uncle Haim was a little, little- a little boy, about 4 or 5 or 6, maybe 8. But no more than that. And one thing that got my dad, I think to come back- one thing that got my dad to come on back to the United States is that my grandfather had a lumber yard, as I understand, in Vilna or in Kovno-

B.B.:

Vilna.

R.L.:

Vilna, I believe. And there was a great fire in Vilna. And my father took his 8:00younger brothers and sisters and they all walked on a frozen river0 across a frozen river and kept on going to Kovno. I used to ask Uncle Nat where you were from. Uncle Nat would always say "I'm Kovno. I'm from Kovno." Well, really he was from Vilna but he went to Kovno because my father took he, and there was another younger that they had tagging along with them.

R.L.:

And it was strange because Uncle Nat ran into this man sometime in the early 1950's down in Florida. And they started talking and the man says to Uncle Nat, "Do you remember the fire in Vilna in 19 such and such?" And my Uncle Nat says, "Yes." He says, "I'll never-" and the man said to Uncle Nat, "There was a big 9:00boy with two little smaller boys with him. And he took me by the hand and brought me on with them across that river and on to Kovno to safety." And Uncle Nat just went ecstatic. [inaudible 00:09:24] He said, "I was one of the little boys!" And the man says, "Well, believe it or not, I was the little boy that tagged along with you all."

R.L.:

So that was a very touching story and I always remembered that. But getting back to- I was very fortunate being the eldest in our family of the first generations here. I am the eldest of all cousins and of course the first one born to my mother and dad, and so naturally I've got- I've got a brother and a sister. I've got a sister, Anita, Anita Feels and she lives in Boston, now. And my brother 10:00Allen who lives down in Florida. But, nevertheless, getting back to the story, to go on with it.

R.L.:

I was very fortunate that I actually knew both of my grandparents Esther and Eudel. Of course, fortunately enough I still had my grandmother, my mother's father, because I was named for my grandmother on my mother's mother. But, back to being the eldest. I knew Esther and Eudel. And I used to remember this old uncle that would come down from Columbus that looked after my father and looked after Uncle Nat. Oh I forgot to tell you.

R.L.:

Uncle Nat, when he first came here, they dropped him off in Columbus, Ohio for a year or two because he went to high school there or went to school there. They 11:00saw that he had an education. Oh, I forgot to tell you also, that old uncle that was in Columbus was in prison up there. He happened to be the prison chaplain. And that was a very funny thing because when the stories are told, "oh my god, we had a family member that was a jail bird!" But really, he wasn't, he was a volunteer chaplain from the Jewish community in Columbus. And at that time apparently there were quite a few Jews in prison there, for some reason or another, for one thing or the other.

R.L.:

Nevertheless, we all grew up. I was very pleased that I knew I had uncles and aunts on both sides of my family. And enjoyed a very nice childhood in 12:00Lexington. And different things of that nature. When he went- my dad, when he went on to Lexington he was in the live poultry business. And, chickens- he used to ship chickens. He would collect them up from the different small dealers out in small communities and put all together a freight car load, which was very similar to cattle cars. But you had to have a man to ride on the car with him and that was one of the jobs Uncle Nat had.

B.B.:

What was your Uncle Nat's last name?

R.L.:

Oh. Uncle Nat Levy. [inaudible 00:12:48] Uncle Nat Levy, yeah. That was Uncle Nat Levy. And then Uncle Haim he followed along with the chickens, also. And 13:00they all had the pleasure of riding chicken cars, even my father. Riding them to New York and different things. And so, they got to see the country side and the big towns, and good times and bad times, and found out from Uncle Nat- Uncle Nat met this young lady- [crosstalk 00:13:23] Kentucky - Irma.

R.L.:

And of course once he met Irma, well that's all it was to Uncle Nat's riding chicken cars. He didn't do that anymore. And it was often told in the family-my father had a nickname for my Aunt Irma. Whodo. It's not a who do this and who do that, it's because she put a curse on a carload of chickens one time. She didn't want Uncle Nat to leave town, and she says "I hope the dang gone things die." Low and behold, they got sick and they died. Not the whole carload, but they 14:00didn't have very much left when they go to New York.

R.L.:

Now-

B.B.:

And so, what brought you to Louisville?

R.L.:

What got me was the necessity of having to do something other than being in the [inaudible 00:14:19] chicken business. Didn't want to be in the chicken business, and I needed- I had a wife that was about 8 months pregnant, that I had to pick up and bring to Louisville against, fighting all the way. She was going to leave her friends in Louisville- Lexington. Well, we came on to Louisville and I must say it's been a very pleasant, sometimes tough, but other times, for the most part very, very pleasant. And my association with my uncle for about 24 years was a real pleasure. Had good times and bad times, but it was 15:00a- altogether it was a real pleasure. Had my cousin Bobby. My wife's name, I forgot all about that. "What is your name, Delores?"

Delores :

"Shut up, Raymond."

R.L.:

[laughing 00:15:15] "Shut up Raymond," that's her name. That's always the case. "Shut up, Raymond." But, my wife is Delores Schech. Now, Delores Schech came from-[crosstalk 00:15:28] Kentucky. And came to the University of Kentucky in 1945. And I forgot to tell you that in 1943 I joined up in the Navy- joined up with the Navy and of course I had my trips overseas and on ships and this and that and the other. But, my Ant Irma helped me get in the Navy because I had bad eyesight when I wanted to volunteer and they wouldn't take me because my eyesight. And my uncle and Ant Irma took me to the doctor [inaudible 00:15:59] and we got carrot juice. And about 3 months on carrot juice, boy, my eyesight 16:00sure improved. And, so that's a commercial for carrot juice.

R.L.:

But when I came home from the Navy finally and was discharged on April the 26th, 1946, I got back to Louisville on April the 27th. I walked in the house, my Mama says "Hello, darling" she hadn't seen me for 13 or 14 months. "Hello, darling," this and that, and the other, "Have I got a girl for you." [laughing 00:16:34] Delores Schech-

Delores :

That's right!

R.L.:

And here comes Delores. But nevertheless, Delores and I after a off again, on again courtship for about 4 years we decided- or 3 1/2 years, we decided to get married. And then we had a little problem along the way, but that's all right. 17:00We overcame all that stuff. Delores got sick, and we couldn't get married when we wanted to, and she was sick for about 18 months. But everything turned out all right. And here we are.

Delores :

[inaudible 00:17:19]

R.L.:

It was cause she had a little, she had a- wasn't a social disease, you can't say that. It was- she had tuberculosis. And this is a strange thing, about 3 months or 4 or 5 months before that, I got polio on my 24th birthday. And that was a lot of fun.

B.B.:

And that was after you came home from the Navy?

R.L.:

Oh, after I came home from the Navy, absolutely.

B.B.:

Where had you been in the Navy?

R.L.:

Oh, I started out up in Great Lakes Illinois -

B.B.:

[inaudible 00:17:51]

R.L.:

-and boot camp and then went down to Gulfport, Mississippi for Gunnery training. Now, mind you, that I had all this eye trouble, and damn if they didn't make a 18:00gunner- a gunner made out of me. And that shows you how screwed up the military was. And it's remarkable that we won the war. But, I figured out after I got in and everything was going to be cool. And of course here I am, from Gulfport we went down to New Orleans and caught our ships. And by a stroke of fate I begged to get on one- ship the John A. Johnson with a bunch of my friends, and they wouldn't see, the people that gave out the assignments wouldn't let me do that. They wanted me to be on a certain ship with another bunch, and that I got on with. And unfortunately, that Autumn, the John A. Johnson got torpedoed in the South Pacific, and all my friends- they all went down with the ship. As the Japanese sub surfaced, it strafed them all.

R.L.:

So, that's another story of life. But, and it just shows you maybe I'm living a 19:00charmed life and don't realize it. After all these ups and downs and everything like that.

R.L.:

Betty had asked, where all did I go in the South, well, I went out of New Orleans to Cuba and stayed around Cuba for about a week and then we caught another convoy from Cuba to Panama and low and behold, one evening, at dusk, we were fired on by a Japa- by a German sub. And luckily enough, they missed us and hit another ship. That's just the irony of, of-

B.B.:

War.

R.L.:

The thing and the irony of war. And so we proceeded on through the Panama Canal and then we were on our own and I was on the way to New Guinea. This was in 20:00about February 1944. And we got on down the line, rode down the coast of South America before we took off across the Pacific. And we were traveling by ourself until we picked up the convoy. Just, when we got over to the- off the coast of New Zealand, and then we went on into New Guinea. And then we traveled around there and then the invasion of the Admiralty Islands and stuff like that.

R.L.:

All fun and games that's all. People shooting at each other.

B.B.:

Were you around Iwo Jima?

R.L.:

No. Iwo Jima was another- I was up near Iwo Jima. I went to Okinawa-

B.B.:

Okinawa.

R.L.:

I bypassed Iwo Jima and went to Okinawa. I had come back to the States before I got on another ship and got into the amphibious force. But I made a mistake and got a promotion. And that caused me nothing but trouble after that. So I had to 21:00look after other people, then.

B.B.:

And what did you do in the amphibious force?

R.L.:

I was in a repair unit and running little small boats there to run up on beaches. And I didn't have to run any troops up on any beaches. But we were preparing for that, for the big thing off of Okinawa of course, and the war ended. I was on Okinawa when the bombs were dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. And nevertheless, that's- I have to say that 33 or 34 months in the Navy was just... You know, you look back on the years from 18-21 and you think to yourself, gosh these are great times and created the best years of life. These were some of the best years of my life. I've had other great years-

Delores :

With the children-

R.L.:

With my children and with my wonderful bride Delores Ruth. And, but I've enjoyed- I have enjoyed life here in Louisville. Of course it's needless to say it's awful nice having Bob and Betty. And as Betty and I've been brother and sister. I've never looked on it as any other way in all these years. But nevertheless, that's about the story.

R.L.:

Now the, well my childhood friends in Lexington, not many of them do I see much more. There is one. The best man in our wedding, and I was best man in theirs, is Manuel and Debra Singer. And of course they've come back to Louisville and occasionally I'll talk to him or see him. But I really don't see him as- because 23:00we've made a different life here in Louisville.

R.L.:

And I've tried to have them involved into it, but it doesn't always work out that way. It's strange. You make new friends. I'm often reminded about [inaudible 00:23:21].

Delores :

[inaudible 00:23:21]

New Speaker:

-and that's the way it is. We go back to Lexington, I would imagine, every once in a while. I don't get to Lexington maybe 2, 3 times a year. And it's mainly because we still have family over there. Uncle Haim's son Earl, and his wife Sarah Ann, and of course we're very attached- and Pauline of course, which was Uncle Haim's wife. Strangely enough she was also my mother's, her father was my mother's cousin but, you're playing with this gizmo here. This thing.

B.B.:

I don't know why I was doing that.

R.L.:

Yeah, but anyway, we'll have to keep on going here. Going back to my life as a child, in Lexington, of course, my mother Betty, and her real name was Rebecca. And my Uncle Bob-

B.B.:

What was her last name?

R.L.:

Kravetz. K-r-a-v-e-t-z. And we had a nice- a nice family relationship in Lexington. I had my Aunt Tanya, and her two daughters, Jean and Irene, and Jean and I were always very close, always. And who? I'm sorry.

New Speaker:

[inaudible 00:24:53]

R.L.:

Her husband, of course, Uncle Nathan. Uncle Nathan looked after- made sure that I stayed in clothes all the time, and had a little store over in Winchester, a 25:00little man- a man store over in Winchester. That was fun. We'd go over there all the time and when Dad would take me along on the chicken trucks and turkey trucks with him, and everything, I always had to stop off at [inaudible 00:25:20], that was Ant Tanya's Yiddish name. As far as my father, he always called it Tyba. Tyba this, and Tyba that. Nevertheless, but my mother and my mother's brothers. And then finally Aunt Sarah came back in Lexington after her husband [inaudible 00:25:41] Ant Sarah Mickler and that was mother's oldest sister- older sister. Or, Ant Sarah was actually mother's sister and she was a little bit older than mother.

B.B.:

Was she related to the Micklers here in Louisville?

R.L.:

She was, indeed. She was related to the Micklers here. Her husband and Eddie 26:00Mickler were brothers. And Eddie had two children,

Delores :

And Eddie's Wife.

R.L.:

-and Eddie's wife, Lily. Well, Lily w among thes a cousin. And I mean this is the way life was in the old days, Jewish people. This one had a cousin and that one had a cousin and I want you to meet my cousin this and my cousin that, and not the next thing you know, they've been married. Now, not cousins actually marry cousins, but cousins related, had an in between cousin. They was related on one side and they were related on the other.

R.L.:

But, nevertheless. When Ant Sarah's husband, Uncle John passed away, they had lived in Providence, and went out to Tucson, Arizona. But, as for Uncle John passed away and Ant Sarah brought back her son, Bobby, and daughters, Sylvia and 27:00Margie, and of course now Margie and Sylvia both are gone. As Ant Sarah and it's odd that mother- my mother and Ant Sarah got sick the same year and passed away within two weeks of each other. [crosstalk 00:27:26]

Delores :

No, no.

R.L.:

Well, we'll just go on with this, Betty. I need to digress a bit because to let you know something about my mother. Of course, I spoke most everything about my father. It's just a recent, within the last 3 or 4 years I've really got some background on my great-grandparents and my mother's maiden name as I said was Kravetz. And her father's name was Burl. Burl Kravetz. And we called him Barry. And that's where I got the middle name for my eldest son, Eudel Barry.

R.L.:

But, getting back to my mother's family, she had two brothers and a sister. Robert and Louis Kravetz and Sarah. And Sarah. And in Lexington we had our great-uncle, David Adeis and [crosstalk 00:28:28] his family. Beg pardon? I'm sorry.

Delores :

Give your parents and how many sisters and brothers [crosstalk 00:28:31]-

R.L.:

[crosstalk 00:28:32] Oh, my, my, my sister, I'm sorry-

B.B.:

How about your mother's mother. What was her name?

R.L.:

Her name was Rose. And my grandmother passed away. She was Rose Adeis and she passed away in 1911 at the ripe old age of 50. And [crosstalk 00:29:02] she had several brothers- she was one of seven children. And she had, as I recall, 3- 29:00she had 3 brothers Simon, Abies, [interview cuts off 00:29:17]

R.L.:

Our second child, Michael was born in 1958. And September the 1st on the day of his grandmother's birthday. His grandmother Eugenia or [inaudible 00:29:30] and Michael is married to Sue Daniels. And she's from Dayton. They met in college, just like his mother and dad did. Only, he got on through the college, and dad's still struggling. I'm still struggling through college [inaudible 00:29:53]. And Sue and Michael got married in 19-

Delores :

1981.

R.L.:

1981. A little over ten years ago and they've got a son [inaudible 00:30:05] and 30:00his name is Jacob Edward Levy. He's named for great-grandfather on one side and a grandfather- [crosstalk 00:30:21]

Delores :

He's named for his grandfather [crosstalk 00:30:24]

R.L.:

His grandfather and his great-grandfather. [inaudible 00:30:28] was my father-in-law, Delores's father. And then we have, along came 1966, 1967, I'm sorry. Surprise! Here is Ira Richard Levy.

Delores :

He's so big.

R.L.:

My father- my father passed away in 1966 and one year later Richard was born. And Richard is now in the seventh year of a four year course in college. 31:00[crosstalk 00:31:09] And, but Richard- he has enjoyed life to its fullest. He got to do everything a young man would want to do in school, and high school, grade school, he was on the basketball, he was on the starting basketball team of his high school, he traveled with the Jewish Community Center all over the United States and, believe it or not, they even went to Israel to play basketball in the summer of nineteen eighty- about 1985 or '86.

B.B.:

And was that a special group of games?

R.L.:

No, that was nothing special. It was just a-hold on, cut me off there.

R.L.:

I wanted to talk about my son Mike, who was born, as I said, in 1958. Michael is an attorney and Sue, when they married and she started teaching school and she'd been a school marm off and on but when Jacob was born, when she quit and now she's started back, thank goodness. And Sue went on to get her advanced degrees in education and Michael got an advanced degree and he too is an attorney. So, now I've got, not only two sons and a daughter-in-law that are attorneys, but I've got me a school marm. And then I've got that one son that he is still in college, bless his heart, but he's sticking to it, though. He's cranking away at it all the time.

R.L.:

Now, he's become the manager of a restaurant and everything like that. Life just keeps going right along. And Jacob is going to have a little brother or sister 33:00sometime, the good Lord willing-

Delores :

March.

R.L.:

March. And a little cousin sometime right at the first of January. So, we'll see what all this life has in store for us. And it's been good.

R.L.:

It was suggested that I talk about Delores and I when we first came to Louisville. We came to Louisville and we lived in 1921 Roanoke. Was that it? Something like that. And that's where Eudel was born. And I had the very good fortune of having a first cousin, my mother's cousin in the same building. Louis and Sophie Margolis. And Louis was son of Toby, whom I mentioned back there- my grandmother's sister's son, Toby. And that's whose granddaughter is coming here 34:00this weekend.

R.L.:

But nevertheless, getting back to that, Delores and I started getting involved, and we had the good fortune of having good friends across the street from us [crosstalk 00:34:17] that we met when we first came to Louisville. And [inaudible 00:34:28] but we progressed and I went in- my uncle took me into the real estate business- Uncle Nat- took me into the real estate business. And I stayed with him until he passed on in 19-

Delores :

80.

R.L.:

1980. [inaudible 00:34:49] Over- almost over- over 11 years. And nevertheless, I 35:00enjoyed that relationship. One to watch. I should have listened to him a bit more, maybe, but I learned a lot. And I had a nice relationship with he and Bob and my cousin Bobby-

Delores :

With him.

R.L.:

We had another associate in the office, Bing Kaplan, that was another case. Now Bing Kaplan used to chomp, chew and chomp on cigars and chew tobacco. Yuck! And nevertheless he broke Bobby and I into smoking cigars and we gave him a good going away present at the time. We wanted to make sure that he went on his ride [crosstalk 00:35:42] a couple cigars in his pocket. And got Sonny [inaudible 00:35:46] to put those cigars in there for him. Not- Sonny didn't do it, Shirley did. His man at the Kaplan funeral home.

B.B.:

And was there a story about when you and Bob went to appraise or buy-

R.L.:

Oh, Bobby, Bobby started me in the appraisal business and went down to appraise a funeral home one time. And he wouldn't do it. We went into this funeral home and in the display room of caskets. I went out of the room for a minute and looked around the rest of the place and Bobby climbs up there and I come back and he's got a cigar sticking up out of his mouth and he's going "oooooooohhhhhhhh ooooooohhhhh" and I thought he'd lost his cotton picking mind. Told him to get up out of that casket before I had to pay for something before we got out of there. But nevertheless that was just a laugh. But we had a- Bobby and I always had a good time doing silly things.

R.L.:

And that's another story. [inaudible 00:36:56] Real estate program, an agent, what have you. And then when Uncle Nat passed away, of course I went on to 37:00[inaudible 00:37:03] and stayed there for eleven years up until two months ago and took off, because I'd been working for Bank of Louisville, and I'd been very fortunate at my age to get a job doing appraisals about 5, 6 years ago. And I've held onto that job every since. And it seems like I can't get loose from the work now. And it's been an enjoyable- it's been an enjoyable thirty five, going on thirty six years right here in Louisville. Okay.

R.L.:

It was suggested I talk about Delores's and my involvement with the synagogue, oh for about 20 years. I ended up being on the Board of Directors at Adath Jeshurun. Delores was very active in the Sisterhood and she was an officer in 38:00the Sisterhood, and I sang in the choir- sang in the choir for about 15, 16 years. I was instrumental in hiring [inaudible 00:38:12], who is now our [inaudible 00:38:14] at Adath Jeshurun. It's very unusual. A Yale graduate, his wife lived [crosstalk 00:38:26], an eye specialist, an ophthalmologist, they turned out to be all right people. We were- we were- we were- we enjoyed the synagogue extremely, a lot. Our boys knew what going to shul meant and they're involved in the shul now. They've slowly become involved in the shul.

R.L.:

And they attended religious services there about every Shabbat and we, Delores 39:00and I started doing [inaudible 00:39:15]

B.B.:

Bar mitvahs.

New Speaker:

and doing the [inaudible 00:39:16] and I think that for the time the kids were almost infants. And after every [inaudible 00:39:23] and we really became very much involved in the synagogue. And Delores's parents I guess were very much involved in their synagogue at Keneseth Israel and that's- I guess some of that spilled over into our lives.

R.L.:

But I chose Adath Jeshurun primarily because [inaudible 00:39:55] who was the [inaudible 00:39:56] at the time, when we first came here and right after I lost my mother, I really got involved with the synagogue. Got into the choir and even 40:00with Rabbi Gittleman on Sholom and all those things. Richard, later went on to, as a baby, Delores decided he wasn't going to have to go to Hebrew school in the afternoons like the other boys. So Richard grew up in the church [inaudible 00:40:26]. As everyone knows it was his second home [crosstalk 00:40:31] because he went to Jewish Day School [crosstalk 00:40:34], which was located at the center. And after school was out, why Richard just hung around that gym and he became a fixture there. And now, of course, he's very active there at the center in athletics. And everybody wants Richard on the team.

Delores :

[inaudible 00:40:53]

R.L.:

Now, all three boys were Bar Mitzvahed at Adath Jeshurun and read from the Torah 41:00and did a [inaudible 00:41:05] to complete and they were able to conduct the services. I'm very proud of them because those are things that I can't do. I guess that's the nice thing about seeing things like that. And those kids, they're not the worst [inaudible 00:41:23] right now. [inaudible 00:41:24] I have to keep doing this, all the time, y'all worry us to death, but I'm glad they did. Delores did that, not me. Nothing else that I can really say, is there something else that I need to talk about?

R.L.:

I'm ready to cut off really, but I mean that's besides the point. It was suggested that perhaps [crosstalk 00:41:51] I talk a little about, that I reminisce a little about how I've seen Louisville change over the past 35 years. Remember, that when we came here in 1956, the Jewish Community Center, I think 42:00just opened up out on Dutchmans Lane. And we watched [inaudible 00:21:12] of the shuls moving out of downtown - Anshei Sfard moving out on Dutchmans Lane. We've seen Adath Jeshurn move in from Brooking College, Keneseth Israel where we'd gotten married, Delores and I. I have to say Delores and I got married at Adath Jusehurn- at Keneseth Israel and my goodness, what year was that? Oh!

R.L.:

November the 4th, 1951. Now guess what's going to happen if we both make it until next Monday. We will have been married for 40 years. And that's pretty 43:00good I guess.

Delores :

Sure is tough.

R.L.:

It sure is. You can say that again! You can say that again! Sure is tough. But nevertheless, we've seen the downtown area [inaudible 00:43:24] used to be at 320 South 6th Street, Uncle Nat's office and his office and my office, and Bob's office, Bing Kaplan's office ,and Old Man Bill [Ceopeland's 00:43:36] office, all of us were in the same office. But we've seen that place become now the Hall of Justice, and we've seen-

Delores :

[inaudible 00:43:47]

R.L.:

-the changes in downtown area, it died [crosstalk 00:43:52] and we thought it was going to turn to dust, then with the urban renewal moved us three times. 44:00Moved us from 320 South 6th Street up to the 2nd floor over 320 South 6th Street. From there, over to the Realty building and we- Bobby and Uncle Nat and Bing and I supervised the building of the Citizens Fidelity Plaza after, until they got past the 9th floor. Then we kind of had to look up high every day.

R.L.:

But, nevertheless, we've seen those changes and the way the downtown area, the coming of the Galleria, which is good and bad. I've still got mixed emotions about should that have ever happened. We've seen the development along the riverfront. I saw, and I'm very proud as I go around and I see some of the 45:00things that I've done myself with the development of [inaudible 00:45:15], a banking company down at 18th and Broadway. How they were able to stay in place because we were able to find more land. And I bought land for them. I got around the expressways around town here, and Bobby had a very good friend, Roger Pox, that gave me a job as a buyer for the [inaudible 00:45:39] the [inaudible 00:45:39] position at the highway department. And that job was a wonderful job that I had in 1960 along with my real estate business with Uncle Nat.

R.L.:

But I'd go out and down in the West End on any night of the week and on the weekends and find the right away along the rivers and the parkway, which is 46:00called Interstate 64 of course, that section of the downtown area. Then when we bought the right away of the Sherman River Bridge, we watched it- Bobby and I even go back to the construction of the Sherman River Bridge which was about 1956 right when I came here to Louisville. And bought the right away from there all the way down to Algonquin Parkway along the Shawnee Parkway or Shawnee Expressway.

R.L.:

And I look at St. Anthony's Hospital, how they were able to get parking lots and things of that nature. A good client that Uncle Nat introduced me to was B. B. Cook. And buying a plant for he and very proud of the fact that ha had enough land for B. B. Cook that he donated to the Baptist towers, which is now 2nd Street and I drive by there I think to myself, goodness gracious. I bought the 47:00land for those people. And I look at old Baptist Hospital now, which is now owned by the county offices, and all those new parking lots that I helped them to acquire.

R.L.:

There's so many things. Life has gone on and life has been good on the whole. And I have no regrets. I have regrets, I've had a few [singing 00:47:41]. And I don't want to go into song, because I can't even remember all the words. But that's about it until, unless Betty can think of something else. And I don't know what else I can say. I loved to go to parties and be called on and I see 48:00people around, somebody will call on a person. And they'll always give "Well, I don't know what to say." I really didn't know what to say when Betty asked me to start doing this little interview. My god, it's gone on for, do you realize it's gone on for almost an hour? And I could keep on laying it on.

B.B.:

Well, I think it's been a wonderful hour and we thank you very much for sharing your recollections with us, Raymond. They've been wonderful. And I'm sure that your family for many years to come will enjoy listening. We thank you so much.

B.B.:

Betty Bronner signing off.