Interview with Neta Evans, March 1, 2013

JF: Okay, now we're going. Okay. It is the first day of March, of all things.

NE: I didn't realize that.

JF: This is March 1st, 2013, it's gray and snowy this morning. Did you see the snow when you went out to your hair appointment this morning, did you?

NE: It was just a little bit. Just a little bit.

JF: I'm sitting here in the very comfortable living room with Ms. Evans, Neta Evans. Are you from Louisville? Is this your home all your life?

NE: I was born in Louisville.

JF: Born in Louisville. What-

NE: On End Street.

JF: End Street. Where did you go to school and all that?

NE: I went to Semple.

JF: Semple Elementary?

NE: Yeah, elementary. Then I went to the Southern Junior High, and then I moved to Girl's High, and in my sophomore year, I think, I went up to Washington Courthouse, and lived with my sister and her husband.

JF: That's in Ohio?

NE: In Ohio, just between Cincinnati and Columbus.

JF: Yeah, I see those signs all the time, but I've never been there, but I see the signs. Washington Courthouse.

NE: They're the best two years of my life.

JF: Really?

NE: I graduated from high school up there, and had the best time.

JF: How about that.

NE: Oh, it was so different from Louisville, just a little small town.

JF: Well sure, a little town, yeah.

NE: And he was the preacher in town, you know, so.

JF: Lot of changes.

NE: He had a lot of advantages and of course I did too-

JF: How about that.

NE: Because I lived with him.

JF: Wow, you have a lot of history in that place, too, in Washington Courthouse.

NE: Oh, I imagine.

JF: How about that.

NE: I wasn't interested in that, I was just interested, there were boys at the school.

JF: Making your own history right then, weren't you?

NE: Right.

JF: That's good. Did you meet your husband there, or anything? Or was that back, that was later on, back here.

NE: No, no, no.

JF: So you came back to Louisville, then, huh? After you graduated from high school?

NE: After I graduated I came back.

JF: And what did you do after you graduated from high school?

NE: I went to work for Dan Burry and Everett Roe. They were manufacturer's representative.

JF: Okay.

NE: In a building at Third and Main. In the oldest building, oh, it was horrible. Had to walk up three flights of stairs every time you went in or out.

JF: Third and Main, is that where the convention center is now, was it over where Levy Brothers was? Or I was trying to... Third and Main.

NE: No, no, no.

JF: No, that's Liberty. I'm thinking of Liberty, Third and Liberty. Oh, yeah, yeah, Main was up, yeah.

NE: Yeah. And I had to go to the basement, with the janitor to get something. I'm in this huge building, and there was only two other people who worked in the offices.

JF: Oh, my god.

NE: Because they were redoing some of it. And I thought, "I'm out of my mind coming down here with the janitor." But he was as nice as he could be, he was getting something for me, and I wanted to show him what I needed.

JF: No scary stuff in the basement, though, once you got down there, huh?

NE: No, I didn't know what was down there.

JF: In an old building like that, yeah.

NE: So I worked for them.

JF: What were you doing for them, what were... You were just like...

NE: I was just the only girl in the office.

JF: Ah, and you did everything.

NE: Everything they needed to have done. But the business didn't last.

JF: This was in when? Was this in, what years was that? That was in the...

NE: Probably 40...

JF: In the '40s some time?

NE: '49, '48, '49 somewhere along in there.

JF: So how long were you with them?

NE: Until they went out of business.

JF: Which was how many years?

NE: Oh, not very long.

JF: Yeah.

NE: They just were partying I think, because they would ask me to go to the drugstore, and take my time.

JF: Ah, that's funny.

NE: But...

JF: So where did you go from there? What did you do from there?

NE: From there I went to work for the... I don't know what they call it now, the Miss Louisville thing?

JF: Oh, really.

NE: Yeah.

JF: The Miss Louisville Pageant you mean?

NE: Uh-huh (affirmative).

JF: Oh.

NE: Who was, what was his name?

JF: That had to be interesting.

NE: Lee Richards and Gene Heinman. One of them was involved in the pageant, and 4:00they found out I was going to need a job, and asked me to come to work for the pageant. So I did.

JF: How about that.

NE: And I worked there all that summer, and it was fun. It really was, yeah.

JF: I bet it was, yeah. A little different I'm sure.

NE: It was so different from anything I'd ever done.

JF: Didn't have to go to the basement, yeah, right.

NE: Yeah. No, I would go over on Fourth Street and try to sell tickets. You know we had a-

JF: Oh yeah, Fourth Street was hopping.

NE: At Guthrie Park.

JF: Oh yeah.

NE: We sat right in front of it and people just went by, and it was fun. I enjoyed that.

JF: Good. How did you make contact with the Binghams? That wasn't through that, was it?

NE: No, no. When my husband left me, I had to go back to work. And I got a job at Jones' Apothecary up here on Third Street, and I worked there for two years, 5:00and I got a call... Who was it? I don't know. Somebody called and said that... How did I get to Kentucky Rural Electric? Oh, my neighbor called, and said that Addison McGee was looking for somebody to help him, and would I be interested? And I said, "Well I'd like to go talk to him."

JF: Sure.

NE: And I did, and he hired me, and I quit Jones's, and worked at Kentucky Rural Electric for two or three years.

JF: Where were they located?

NE: Out on...

JF: Was that on Bishop Lane?

NE: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

JF: Yeah, okay, yeah.

NE: Well, they let him go. They let Addison go. That made me mad, because I liked him. He was a really, when he talked, you listened.

JF: Yeah.

NE: And so I just gave my resignation to them, not knowing what I was going to do.

JF: Wow.

NE: He said, let me do something. He said, "I know Basil Caummisar at the Courier, let me call him and see if they have anything." I went to work for Basil Caummisar. He needed somebody.

JF: Well how about that. So that's how you got in the building, then.

NE: And while I was working for him, Barry Jr. moved back to Louisville to take over WHAS from Vic Sholis. That was what he had trained for. And where was I going?

JF: So this was in, what year would this have been, when you went to work for The Courier-Journal? Do you remember what year that was?

NE: That was '63.

JF: 1963.

NE: Uh-huh (affirmative).

JF: And how long were you working with Mr. Caummisar before you started for Barry Jr. then?

NE: He came back in '64, I think. And then shortly after that he started looking 7:00for somebody, and I don't know why, I thought, "I'll just put my name in."

JF: So you applied for the job.

NE: I did.

JF: How about that.

NE: And there were several who applied for it.

JF: Now this was all in The Courier-Journal building there at Sixth and Chestnut, was it still-

NE: Sixth and Broadway.

JF: Oh, Sixth and Broadway. Sixth and Broadway.

NE: And that Thanksgiving, I was going to Florida to visit my sister and her family, the ones I lived with, and went down there. And they knew I was waiting to hear. I got back home, and when I got back, I had an appointment with Clive Rumble, and Barry Bingham Jr. And I got the job.

JF: Wow. Did it surprise you? Did you...

NE: Oh, talk about surprised.

JF: Because you hadn't been there very long then, had you?

NE: No, no.

JF: How about that.

NE: And I didn't even know who he was.

JF: Is that right?

NE: No, I'd never seen the man.

JF: But you knew what the job would entail?

NE: Yeah.

JF: Is that why you applied for it?

NE: I did. Well, I did everything he needed done.

JF: Yeah. Did he have his handlebar mustache at that time? Or when did that start?

NE: I don't think he did.

JF: Yeah. That was his trademark later years.

NE: He might have had... Oh, yeah. He had to order his wax from up in New York.

JF: Is that right?

NE: He finally got Walgreen's to carry it.

JF: Was it a certain brand, was it?

NE: Oh, yeah.

JF: He had to be a certain kind, certain brand.

NE: Everything with him was that way.

JF: I'll be darned.

NE: Yeah, he had certain things that nothing else would do.

JF: What was The Courier-Journal building like during that time, when you first went in there and you were working? Pretty nice place? Good people and everything?

NE: It was. I loved it. I loved it, I really did.

JF: I remember they had the cafeteria up there and everything, it was like a little community in itself, really.

NE: And it was good food.

JF: Yeah.

NE: They had people that came in early and cooked then.

JF: Yeah, good, it was cooked stuff, yeah.

NE: And on Monday they always had bread pudding.

JF: Good bread pudding, I take it.

NE: And it was out of this world. I couldn't wait to get up there on Monday.

JF: Well now, you're working at The Courier-Journal building, you've got of course the reporters and things, there were a lot of those who were well known and everything, and radio and television were there at that time, too.

NE: That was still there, yeah. When did they... I was trying to think-

JF: In the late '60s, about '68 or '69 when they moved.

NE: Was it? Because I know we moved to the third floor. When I got the job, we moved to the third floor.

JF: That's you and Mr. Bingham.

NE: And I was trying to think... I started with him in October of '65.

JF: October '65.

NE: Yeah. And what a change.

JF: Tell me about that, tell me about the change.

NE: Oh, well here was Mr. Bingham Sr., walking through and mister... what was his name. Who was the man that retired?

JF: Not Cy MacKinnon, or...

NE: No, the one before MacKinnon. Who was that?

JF: I should know that, and I can't think of it.

NE: I know it, I can't either. I even did-

JF: But they're all walking through, and these are-

NE: I even did some work for him.

JF: These are famous, strong, high profile people.

NE: They were. They were, they really were. And I was out of my league.

JF: Well you adjusted pretty well, I'd say, to-

NE: I guess I did.

JF: How long were you with Mr. Bingham then, until he retired, or until they sold? How long were you with them?

NE: Until they sold the paper.

JF: 1985?

NE: Uh-huh (affirmative). '86.

JF: Is that right. '86. Wow.

NE: And from there I went to his house, and worked two years out there.

JF: Wow.

NE: But it was a long drive out there every day, and on bad days I wouldn't even try it. But that was a big old house. It is huge.

JF: So what was the atmosphere like there in The Courier-Journal building, had all these people going through. Did you have contact... when you first went there, you weren't working for Mr. Bingham, but did you have contact with the radio and television people at all, or?

NE: Oh yeah. Yeah. I used to eat with Jean Shellcross.

JF: Oh, yeah.

NE: Shellcross. Shellcross, right?

JF: Shellcross, yeah.

NE: Used to eat lunch with us every day.

JF: Is that right?

NE: Oh, she was a card. She was something else. But I couldn't believe what... Did she have a stroke or what?

JF: I can't remember.

NE: She was on her way home from work, and that on her way home.

JF: That was no good.

NE: Yeah.

JF: So you went, you said change, you went from working then in the building, to working for one of the Bingham family, then, and that was a big change, wasn't it?

NE: Oh heavens, yes.

JF: Moved up to the third floor, had their own offices. What were the offices like there?

NE: They were very nice. First thing they brought me was the lady who was the receptionist on the third floor, was doing various check writing and stuff. She brought all of it back to me, she said, "It's all yours now."

JF: Wow, so you were-

NE: He never wrote a check.

JF: Is that right?

NE: I did them all.

JF: So you weren't a secretary, you were the executive everything, his assistant.

NE: Everything. And he was so nice. It just was unreal.

JF: What would a day be like when you'd go into work? Of course, probably every day was different with him, I bet [crosstalk].

NE: Yeah, well and he was on all these committees, and different meetings, and all. I go in, I get what he had on his desk for me, and take it out and start working.

JF: What type of things would you do? Do you remember something?

NE: Everything.

JF: Like...

NE: Everything. If he wanted somebody... I'd go over into town. I picked a whole bag full, a shopping bag, full of silver from one of the... On Fourth Street, close to Stewart's, I can't remember the name of it.

JF: Wasn't Krupmeyer, wasn't it? No? But anyway, you go and pick up the silver?

NE: He wanted to pick out something for somebody, but he wanted to see it. I went over and got it and brought it back to him. So he could see without him having to get up and go.

JF: Wow. Wow.

NE: You know. But I loved doing those kinds of things.

JF: It would be certainly varied.

NE: Yeah.

JF: You'd have different things to do every day.

NE: Every day. Yeah. One day I spent about an hour walking Fourth Street looking for a certain magazine that he wanted. And nobody had them. But if he wanted it, I did what I could to get it.

JF: So did you do his correspondence and things like that, too?

NE: Yep.

JF: Type his letters and everything, and in addition, everything.

NE: Yep, yep.

JF: Wow.

NE: Yeah, and all the committees that he was on, I needed the work that needed to be done for them. Because-

JF: What type of committees? You mean within the building, or community, or-

NE: No, community.

JF: Community, yeah, yeah.

NE: ATL, he was one of the founders.

JF: Oh yeah, sure.

NE: He and Dan Byck. And just-

JF: So not only Mr. Bingham, but you hobnobbed with community leaders then, too, with Mr. Byck and all those people.

NE: I mean, I'd see them when they came in.

JF: I'm sure, yeah.

NE: When they were with him.

JF: Yeah. That had to be interesting.

NE: It was.

JF: Did you have to do some fast learning on some subjects for anything, or...

NE: Oh, I did. I did. At one point he wanted to name one of the foundations, Crystal Light, and he said, "Can you find where that original name came from?" I would leave work and-

JF: Didn't have computers then, did they.

NE: No. I'd leave work and stop at the library, and go through books there, and I never did find it.

JF: Is that right?

NE: Never did find it. Never did find who originated that name. But he wanted to name whatever it was he was working on Crystal Light.

JF: So your days could be some long days some times.

NE: Oh, they were. Yeah.

JF: Did you normally start at a certain time, or did you have to just according to his schedule?

NE: I was usually there between 7:30 and 8:00, and I never got there that he wasn't already there.

JF: Is that right.

NE: Sitting there reading his paper.

JF: Is that. Nice guy to work for then obviously.

NE: Oh, very. Yeah.

JF: What was he like personally, what kind of guy? Was he shy, was he outgoing, what was he like?

NE: I would say he was outgoing.

JF: But kind to all of the people who worked with him.

NE: Everybody that ran into him, he spoke to. Everybody. Didn't matter who they were. I got a... One morning, he came up the steps and I was already there that day, and he said, "I walked in the back door and here was the mail girl and a boy, belly to belly."

JF: Oh my goodness. Oh my goodness.

NE: I thought that was the funniest thing. I never heard that expression before.

JF: I know. Certainly not from him, that's for sure.

NE: No. No. But anyhow, he could tell some funny stories.

JF: Did you do any traveling with him when he traveled?

NE: No, no.

JF: Did you do any traveling? Everything was here.

NE: Yeah.

JF: Was his family involved, and his wife? Was she involved at all with any of this stuff, or not so much in the office there? She wasn't involved with any of the projects.

NE: No. Maybe, just... Yeah. She backed up everything he wanted to do, and [inaudible 00:16:21].

JF: Yeah.

NE: All of that.

JF: We're doing basically a history of WHAS, so what was your contact with those people, and what kind of things did you have to do with them? Of course, as I said, they were still in The Courier-Journal building at that time.

NE: Yeah.

JF: Were you around the studios at all, or any of those people?

NE: No, no.

JF: He was a hands-off guy with that, then, huh?

NE: Yeah.

JF: Do you remember, I talked with Brench Boden, do you remember Brench Boden?

NE: Oh yeah.

JF: Evidently Brench was Mr. Bingham's go-to guy because of his background with classical music and everything.

NE: Yeah, oh he loved that.

JF: So you were there when they started putting that on the air, I guess?

NE: Oh, yeah.

JF: Were you there the day they signed it on? They told me that the day they first put it on, something didn't work right or something, Mr. Bingham was there 17:00or whatever, and something didn't work right, and they had to delay that or something. That had to be wild.

NE: I don't remember that. Yeah, I don't remember that. But I remember Brench.

JF: Do you? Remember any of the other radio people? Do you remember... Did you have contact over the years with people like Milton Metz or any of those, I think...

NE: Just on the phone.

JF: Yeah. Metz was pretty good friends with Mr. Bingham, I think.

NE: Yeah. Oh, he was... He's such a nice man.

JF: Yeah, he really is.

NE: I was really shocked when I saw him this past year on the crusade, he could hardly walk.

JF: Well he's come back a little bit.

NE: Has he? Good.

JF: I saw him a couple of weeks ago, and he's driving his car.

NE: He was just scooting.

JF: No he must have been not feeling well, because I talked with him a couple of weeks ago, and he was driving his car to go visit his wife, and everything, so that's interesting.

NE: He called... Yeah, I went to work for [inaudible] after I left.

JF: Oh really.

NE: Stayed home 10 years, kids kept saying, "You ought to do something, you 18:00ought to do something." Well, Trish said-

JF: Next door neighbor.

NE: Uh-huh (affirmative). She said, "they're looking for an operator in there." And I said, "I don't know anything about doing operator work." She said, "It's just a telephone." And I went in, and applied, and got that job, and what was I getting ready to tell you?

JF: Well, we're talking about Metz. We were talking about Metz, and then...

NE: I answered the phone, and this voice said that he would like to speak to so-and-so, and I said, "Mr. Metz, hold on just a minute." And he just about died.

JF: That is a very recognizable voice isn't it, yeah.

NE: Oh, you couldn't miss it. You couldn't miss it. And he started calling me by name, which is-

JF: Is that right?

NE: He didn't know me. But I worked up on the third floor at Churchill one year, and he was up there. And he, oh, we talked just like we were old buddies.

JF: Yeah, he's like that.

NE: He's very nice.

JF: He could go anywhere in Churchill towns, I think, and he could get about anywhere, I think.

NE: Yeah.

JF: He was that kind of guy. Let's talk a bit more about operation of the... You said Mr. Bingham wasn't particularly involved in radio, or television, but that was his bailiwick, so his style was just to get good people and let them do their thing.

NE: Yeah, I mean that's what he trained for. He worked CBS or NBC up in New York.

JF: Did you have contact with any of the management people? Vic Sholis, people like that? Did you have any contact with some of those people?

NE: Oh yeah. He was always talking to Vic.

JF: Yeah.

NE: But...

JF: Were you involved in any of the Crusade for Children? Did you do any of that kind of stuff?

NE: No. No, well, I did volunteer work.

JF: Yeah.

NE: You know. And he was there one night, and they were getting ready to give 20:00the total, and he had earphones on. And I said, "That's not fair."

JF: He could hear it first.

NE: So he took one off and put it on my ear.

JF: Is that right?

NE: So I got to hear it too, but it was fun working there.

JF: When do you remember the mustache? When do you remember the mustache, being aware of that, Barry's mustache. Do you remember that?

NE: I don't. I don't. I guess it just...

JF: Just was always there.

NE: It was always there. I'm sure it wasn't, but that's the way...

JF: Yeah, you still picture him that way. One of my first, well, the first time I ever met Barry Bingham Jr., was I was working at WHAS and going by late in the afternoon, maybe the early evening. I was going, nobody else was in the building, there weren't very many people there, and I went by a production studio and I heard these safari sounds coming out. And I thought... and then this man turns around with this handlebar mustache, and I thought, "what's going on?" And he said, "Oh, I'm Mr. Bingham. I'm Barry Bingham Jr." He'd been on a 21:00safari or something, did he do that a lot?

NE: Yeah, well he... Oh, he went I don't know how many times.

JF: Well he had recorded all these jungle sounds, and that's what he was transferring to tape or something, so.

NE: Yeah. Yeah, he went on safari, my gosh, I couldn't tell you how many times. He loved it. Edith went one time with him, and she liked it too.

JF: He was a very nice guy, did he ever get upset about anything? Did he ever, was he upset by anything ever, or... Or when he got upset, how did you know?

NE: If he was, I didn't know it.

JF: Is that right?

NE: No, no.

JF: Always pretty even keeled, then.

NE: He was always the same.

JF: I'll be darned.

NE: He really was.

JF: Have any contact with Mr. Bingham Sr.? Did you have much with him?

NE: Not a whole lot. I did a few things for him when his secretary was out and he needed something, but I-

JF: Was his office near?

NE: No.

JF: They were different parts.

NE: This was before Barry took over.

JF: Yeah.

NE: His office was where Barry's was.

JF: Oh, I see.

NE: There on the third floor. And we were down at the end of the hall.

JF: Yeah.

NE: But he could just walk down the hall if he needed anything, and I could go to take it back. But it was not any distance.

JF: Yeah, let's see. So they moved to the building on Chestnut Street, radio and television did, in I think '68, somewhere along, '68, '69.

NE: I don't know, but it was a sad day for me.

JF: Is that right? Why was that?

NE: It just was. Because I was looking forward to working at WHAS.

JF: Oh, yeah.

NE: And I was going to share an office with Jean, and we ordered my typewriter so it would be compatible with hers. I mean, everything we did was WHAS. And then in... what month did Worth die?

JF: I can't remember. I can't remember.

NE: Well, Mr. Bingham appeared in our office, at the door, and had something up [inaudible], white as a sheet, and he said, "Is Barry in?" And at that time he came walking through the door. And he looked at his dad, and he said, "Father, what is wrong?" He said, "Barry, Worth has been killed."

JF: Oh, wow.

NE: I never felt so bad for somebody.

JF: Wow.

NE: That man was just...

JF: Wow, that was the other son. That was the older son, wasn't it?

NE: He was the one that was supposed-

JF: Take over everything, yeah.

NE: Take over everything.

JF: Had an accident up in the east somewhere, it was in the east.

NE: Up at Cape Cod.

JF: Yeah.

NE: Was taking his family to the beach, and put a surfboard in the car, and going down the street, the surfboard hit a car on the road on the side, and slung and hit him in the neck, right... and then he died. I mean, he...

JF: Wow, that had to be an unbelievable day then. Sad, sad time for everybody.

NE: Oh, I'll never forget it.

JF: Yeah.

NE: The expression on his face just was unreal.

JF: Well that changed everything, didn't it?

NE: It did.

JF: That really changed everything.

NE: It did. And of course he put his foot in, and told Barry he had to take over. And Barry had no training for that.

JF: Yeah. So you were going to go to WHAS in that building and everything then, yeah.

NE: Oh yeah. Right.

JF: And so you stayed there and run The Courier-Journal and everything.

NE: Yeah.

JF: Wow. Wow. What a change.

NE: You know, that had to be hard.

JF: Yeah.

NE: Not to get to do what you had trained to do, and what he loved.

JF: Sure, that was his whole bit, yeah.

NE: Because that's what he liked. He didn't really think about publishing.

JF: Yeah. Wow.

NE: But he had to learn in a hurry, and he did, yeah. But that doesn't mean he had to like it.

JF: Sure. Well you were there, then, during the time that they started to talk about selling everything, and breaking it up. Do you remember anything in 25:00particular about that, or?

NE: No, no. I didn't get in on... I mean, I knew that they were meeting about it, but that's all. I didn't know any of the particulars.

JF: No duties you had to do. Did you have contact with other members of the family? Let's see, well there was-

NE: Sallie, Eleanor.

JF: Sallie. Were there two sisters? Sallie and Eleanor, that's what it was, I remember. So Sallie, Eleanor, and Barry Jr., is what it was.

NE: Because Worth-

JF: Have any contact with any of them? Yeah, Worth would-

NE: Oh, Worth and Johnathan had both already died, so.

JF: Did you have contact with Worth? Was Worth around when you were there?

NE: He was there, yeah. When we first moved to the third floor, he was in the office where the man I can't remember his name had been. And I-

JF: So he was groomed to be taking over everything.

NE: Right, right. And he was good. I mean everybody-

JF: Nice guy?

NE: Nice, yeah. Very nice. I did some work for him when I was downstairs in 26:00public relations. They don't call it that anymore, but he needed somebody to type something for him, and Jean brought it, his girl brought it down, and asked me if I'd type it for him. And I did, and took it up for him to look at, and he said, "Oh, this is a mistake here." So I had to take it back. Back then, you had to type the whole thing over, you know. But he was really nice, very nice.

JF: Good. Very good.

NE: But I didn't get to know him, because that was not long after we moved up there.

JF: Yeah. That he...

NE: That he was killed. I think it was that first year that we were up there, in the summer.

JF: That's when he was killed, huh?

NE: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

JF: Yeah. Wow. So what do you remember from the time that that happened, then? Your life and Barry's life changed, because he's anchored now, instead of going over to do the new building, and radio and television, you're going to do all 27:00the... Didn't have a lot of contact with radio television then after that.

NE: Not after that. No. Because they moved, and had their own building and their own everything.

JF: Yeah, all the people and everything.

NE: Yeah. But...

JF: Well, tell me about if you can remember some of the times when you realized that they were going to be selling, and breaking up everything. What were those days like? What was Barry like during that time?

NE: I didn't know, I didn't think it would ever go through. I didn't think he... They were just trying to settle things, and I don't think, I can't imagine them selling the paper. I just couldn't imagine it.

JF: Was that the general feeling through the building, pretty much? Everybody feel that way?

NE: Oh, I don't know. I don't know. I was in my own little world up there.

JF: Sure. Sure.

NE: I don't know how other people felt about it, I think there were some people who were glad.

JF: Really?

NE: I do. I do. Yeah. On the third floor, so the people on the third floor.

JF: Is that right? So that was an end of an era there, with that building for you. But you say for a couple of years after that you would go to his house, and what would you do during those times?

NE: Same thing I'd been doing all along.

JF: Just taking care of personal stuff?

NE: Yeah, and all of his committee stuff, all the things he joined, and trying to get a new business started.

JF: Yeah, he tried several ventures during that time, didn't he?

NE: Yeah. I think I left right before he started that publishing, Billy Goat Publishing.

JF: Yeah.

NE: At the Courier, he always wanted to name one of his committees something Billy Goat, because he remembered Billy Goat Alley, there by the memorial.

JF: Billy Goat Strut and all that. Yeah.

NE: And nobody would ever go along with it. But he got it, I've got a mug over 29:00there with it.

JF: Oh is that right? That's great.

NE: Yeah, when he opened his office he invited me and he had a mug for everybody he invited. Billy Goat Publishing.

JF: How about that. He finally got it, huh?

NE: He finally got it.

JF: It was a good day.

NE: Yeah.

JF: That's wild.

NE: And he was... What was it? Wasn't on Main Street, and I can't think of... But it's something to do with Billy Goat there.

JF: Yeah, Billy Goat Strut, there's some apartments down there, or condos, or office thing, yeah.

NE: Yeah! He was in that.

JF: Is that right?

NE: Yeah.

JF: So that... I wondered, I always wondered-

NE: That's where his office was.

JF: I always wondered where that name came from. That's what that was. I know Billy Goat the alley down there, I know that, but.

NE: Yeah, by the Memorial Auditorium. At one time, I don't know, it's not still called that, I don't think.

JF: I don't think so. But that's-

NE: But he just loved the name.

JF: Down on Main, sure.

NE: And he was determined he was going to use it, and he got to do it, even if he had to open it himself. But that was...

JF: The last few years of his life he was pretty ill. Was he have any illness when you were with him at all?

NE: Yeah. Yeah. I remember when he went to Massachusetts for, he applied for a huge insurance thing, and they required certain tests, and he had to go up there to have them done. And that's when they found the lymph node on his...

JF: Wow. That wasn't a good day, was it?

NE: No. That was horrible, yeah. And when he was going through all that chemotherapy, I don't know how the man did it. He would come in and he couldn't even move his neck, and he would have a silk scarf around it, because he was burned with that radiation.

JF: Wow.

NE: But he made it through, and he said it was thanks to the Chinese man who 31:00lived there and worked for him, and what he fixed him, he would eat. He could get down. And that was all that he could-

JF: Is that right?

NE: Yeah.

JF: Wow. Wow.

NE: So he said he really gave him all the credit.

JF: Kind of rough there for a while, yeah.

NE: He knew what he was doing.

JF: That's amazing.

NE: But then, later, after he went through all of that, he went back and applied for that policy again, and they passed him. Because they said it's gone.

JF: It's gone. Wow. Wow.

NE: But then he got in that other mess, and of course I don't know much about that, because I was at home, I didn't know anything.

JF: Yeah. What was he like holidays and things like that?

NE: Oh, he just loved holidays.

JF: Really?

NE: Oh yeah. Yeah.

JF: Treated people well during holidays?

NE: He did.

JF: Any special memories of any holidays you were with him or anything, or did you have to do his Christmas shopping for him, or did he do that?

NE: No.

JF: He did that.

NE: Never did that. Never did that. No, we always had a little Christmas party, Christmas Eve in John Richards's office, and they would all be down there, 32:00partying. I'd be taking a tape off that had to go out today, and he'd walk out the door, and he said, "When are you coming down here?" I'd say, "Whenever I get finished." But he was so funny. Every Christmas Eve he had this weird kind of thing that he had to get it out. Had nothing to do with anything, but it was just one of the things that he required.

JF: Like a message he'd record or something, you mean? Or like a-

NE: Oh yeah. He always used a tape recorder to dictate, and on his way to the party, he'd put it on my desk. He said, "I'll sign it when I get back."

JF: Now what was it, what kind of topic was it, was it just some thoughts of his or something, or...

NE: That, a letter he was writing to the people who he bought his car from about the mileage he was getting.

JF: Is that right?

NE: That's it.

JF: Everything.

NE: It's just crazy.

JF: And you had to get it out.

NE: And yeah, who cares about that on Christmas Eve?

JF: On Christmas!

NE: And my son's birthday is today, and I've got to get home.

JF: Oh, goodness. Goodness.

NE: But anyhow.

JF: But he was kind to his employees though, and everything. That was...

NE: He was. He was. He was very good.

JF: Yeah, everybody I've talked with, I knew him just briefly, but everybody I talk with had contact with had high respect for him, and-

NE: I was talking to somebody one day, can't remember... Oh, I called to get a picture of that clock in his office, and it was the photographer at The Courier. This is not, it may be a year ago, because I had the original paper up on top of the clock. And somebody took it off for some reason, so I didn't have him with the clock picture. With the clock, I didn't have the picture. So I called and 34:00told the fellow, and I can't remember his name, very nice, and he said, I just told him it was a picture of Barry with a clock, and it had run in the paper. And just like, he said, "I've got a copy of it right here."

JF: Is that right.

NE: I said, "Are you serious?" He said, "Yes ma'am." I said, "Could you make me one and send it to me?" And I got it in two or three days.

JF: How about that. Well, let's talk about the clock. Tell me about the clock in there.

NE: When he was-

JF: It's a grandfather clock, or it's a clock on the-

NE: It's a regulator clock.

JF: Okay.

NE: When he was going to WHAS he went out to the transmitter one day, that was thrown away in the junk pile.

JF: So at the transmitter building down on Flatlick Road.

NE: At the transmitter out in...

JF: Flatlick Road I think it was, yeah. Or Jay Town, someplace.

NE: Yeah. And he put it in his trunk and took it to the clockmaker downtown, and had it all redone, and it hung in his office, and I wound it every week.

JF: Is that right? Wow.

NE: And so when they were selling, cleaning out his office, I said, "Are you going to take your clock?" And he said, "No." I said, "Then I do."

JF: Ah, so you've got the clock.

NE: And he said, "I'll buy it for you." I said, "You will not. You've done enough for me already. I'll buy it." And I did, and my son and Raymond went in and got it that night.

JF: How about that.

NE: And I just love it. I love it.

JF: Yeah, that's great.

NE: And right now, it's not working.

JF: Oh.

NE: But I've called the clock man who worked on it before, but he was out of town when I talked to him. He just had his phone, and it went on through to him. And he said, "I'll give you a call this weekend, and let you know when I'm coming out."

JF: Oh, that's good.

NE: He was very, and a very nice man. And I lucked out on that, so.

JF: Any other mementos from the office? Take anything else with you, any other memorabilia?

NE: Nothing I can tell you about.

JF: That's funny.

NE: No, there's only one person who knows, and it's not going to be anybody else.

JF: Okay, okay, okay. Sounds like those were some good years for you.

NE: It happened on the last day I was there, before I left.

JF: Oh really. Oh really. Any hints? You going to give us no hints or anything, or?

NE: Nope. Nope. My grandson's the only one who knows.

JF: Ah, that's good. It was a good time for you. So that 1965, that's almost, what, 20 something years, or over 20 years you were there with them. '65 to '88.

NE: Yeah. And then two years out at his house.

JF: Yeah. So it was a good time. Anything particular stand out in your memory?

NE: About?

JF: About working there, or working-

NE: Oh, I just think I was very fortunate to have gotten the job. I just can't imagine, because I didn't have any college.

JF: I'll be darned. And when you got the job, you had no idea what it was going to entail, of course, did you?

NE: Oh no.

JF: You didn't know where it was going to take you, or what was next.

NE: No, well he didn't either. He ended up there.

JF: That's true, he had to make it up as you went.

NE: Yeah. Yeah.

JF: Sounds like it was fun, though.

NE: But I couldn't have asked for anybody any nicer to work for.

JF: Well, good. Very good.

NE: He was never, never showed anything about being upset when he was around me. Now, maybe he was with other people, but he never did, I never saw it. He was always Barry.

JF: That's good.

NE: But I never called him that at The Courier.

JF: Really? It was Mr. Bingham?

NE: It was always Mr. Bingham. Always. But when we went to Glenview, he said, "You can call me Barry," then.

JF: That's good.

NE: And it was just an entirely different thing.

JF: Different atmosphere and everything, yeah.

NE: Yeah. We had an office up on the second floor, and if he and Edith were 38:00going to leave to go on a trip, he'd come over and kiss me goodbye.

JF: Is that right.

NE: And she would, too.

JF: Ah, how about that.

NE: He never even touched me when we worked at The Courier.

JF: How about that.

NE: Never.

JF: Well. Sounds like he relaxed a lot more, so that's good.

NE: He was, yeah. And it was-

JF: Worries off his mind, and good.

NE: He was doing what he wanted to do.

JF: Yeah, that's the goal of everything, isn't it?

NE: Yeah.

JF: So what are you up to these days? What are you... You went to Churchill for a little while, and-

NE: I did. I worked there about eight or nine years, and I worked year round. But I only worked two or three days a week, I didn't work full time. And did you know Margie Duvall?

JF: No, I don't think so. No.

NE: I'm trying to, what's the other one? I think Margie's now the assistant to 39:00whoever's running The Courier.

JF: Oh really?

NE: She's very nice.

JF: No, I didn't know her.

NE: And Yolanda Buford.

JF: No.

NE: She works at U-Ville now, I think in the press [crosstalk].

JF: No, I-

NE: She's the one who hired me.

JF: I was at WHAS, and at that time, we were down the block. I would come over there, personnel stuff was still there at that time, in 1973 when I went over and filled out my application and all that sort of thing. But there was less and less contact, more HAS stuff was in the building at that time, when I was here.

NE: I know it. I know it, it made a difference.

JF: Yeah, I would see Mr. Bingham and some of the others when they would come over, but I'd go to the cafeteria once in a while, meet somebody for lunch. That was nice, but that was about it.

NE: Yeah. But it ran down, too.

JF: Yeah, over the years. Yeah.

NE: Yeah..

JF: Well thank you for taking the time to talk with us, you gave us some good memories of a gentleman whose family and he contributed a lot to our community, and still have a lasting effect.

NE: Oh yeah.

JF: Lot of good memories for you.

NE: Nobody knows how much they did.

JF: Yeah.

NE: It was tremendous.

JF: Yeah, and their attitude toward the community was good, too. It was not, it didn't seem to be a condescending one, it was just-

NE: No, no!

JF: They wanted to help, and wanted to be part of it. They had the power to do it, and they could, so.

NE: Yeah. And they could do it, and they did.

JF: Yeah.

NE: And I think it's wonderful.

JF: Yeah, it is. Well thanks for talking with us, and we'll be in the archives now at the University of Louisville.

NE: Oh how nice.

JF: Thank you.

NE: I just wish I could express how I feel about him, and make it sound good.

JF: I think it's coming through pretty good.

NE: Good, good.

JF: Good.

NE: Because that's the way I felt about him.

JF: Yeah, I remember when I first talked with you, you said, "Okay, if you're expecting me to say something bad about Mr. Bingham, you won't get it from me."

NE: No. No.

JF: And so I...

NE: You won't. There's nothing, no reason to.

JF: That's good. What a legacy.

NE: He never did anything bad as far as I was concerned.

JF: What a legacy to leave.

NE: Oh, yeah. Yeah.

JF: And it seems like also, I think people who didn't know him might say some things, but they don't know. I've had several people, like Bench Boden and several others say, well they just didn't know that I knew what I had... And so.

NE: My sister worked for a doctor in here on Third Street, and they needed somebody to help type something for him one Saturday, and she asked me if I'd come do it. I said, "Sure." So I went in there, and I was typing away, and one of the doctors came down, and said something about working for Barry, and I said, "Yeah." And he said something that made me so mad, and I looked at him, I said, "Have you ever met the man?" And he said, "No." And I said, "I didn't 42:00think so."

JF: He wouldn't be saying that if he did.

NE: That's exactly right. That's exactly right.

JF: That's right, yeah. That's a problem when you're a community figure like that, people can... They don't see the other side.

NE: No, they don't know.

JF: They may disagree with your politics or something, but don't know what kind of person you are. And so-

NE: That makes a difference.

JF: And they never seemed to be vindictive people, I mean if people disagreed with them, they could accept that.

NE: Yeah.

JF: They didn't seem to be vindictive or anything. So that's good.

NE: It just really, it struck me.

JF: Sure. You had to stand up for him.

NE: Yeah. I thought, "You don't even know the man."

JF: Yeah.

NE: And I just looked at him, and I said, "Well have you ever met him," and he said, "No."

JF: Well I have, and that's it.

NE: Yeah.

JF: That's good, what a way to do it. That's good. Well, thank you very much, and we'll put this in the archive, and it will be there forever.

NE: Oh, how nice.

JF: Thanks a lot.

NE: And like, who cares.