Interview with Ken Schulz, February 26, 2013

Jack Fox: All right, here we go. This is, I don't know what day it is. February 26, I believe it is now, 2013. And I'm talking with Ken Schulz, and Ken, you told me that if I didn't mind some ramblings I what now, what did you say?

Ken Schulz: Of an idle mind. You know you have picked the right person, the right day, the right place.

JF: Ken was at WHAS, I didn't realize, thirty years? But, you came in 1978, and retired in 2008.

KS: Yep.

JF: We are going to cover some of those years here. But, let's start. I want to have you tell the story about the first time you came to WHAS, weren't hired yet, but you came over for a job interview.

KS: Yes.

JF: Now, you were twenty-four years old. You were in St. Louis? What were you doing in St. Louis?

KS: I was, initially -- I have a degree in Meteorology. I'm a meteorologist.

JF: There's a school there in St. Louis?

KS: I went to, well, I went to school at St. Louis University.

JF: Oh.

KS: But that was not where and how I came to Louisville. I actually, my first job was in Green Bay, Wisconsin. I was an industrial meteorologist. I forecasted for hire---um, businesses, industries that have weather sense of operations, farming. I was a forecaster for the Jolley Green Giant.

JF: Really?

KS: Yes, and because they have huge farms throughout the country, and depending on the forecast, they will cultivate or irrigate or spray or whatever. But I did some radio stations there.

JF: Oh, really? I didn't know realize that.

KS: There's a private weather service---very small---in Green Bay, Wisconsin. I worked there for two years, and uh---

JF: ---that was right out of school?

KS: Right out of school. It was my first job. And frankly, I felt it would be my only job. It was hard to find a job in meteorology at that time.

JF: Were you looking for a broadcast job?

KS: No.

JF: So it didn't matter.

KS: No. No.

JF: So as a boy you're not growing up and saying one day I want to be on radio 2:00or television doing meteorology.

KS: Emphatically no.

JF: How did you get the interest in meteorology?

KS: I was I had a deathly fear of thunderstorms, uh, as a kid. Um, it was one of those things that would startle me in the middle of the night, you know, just like a bad bad dream. But thunder and lightning initially kind of spooked me. I couldn't get much of an answer from my parents. Loving as they were they were they were not really well versed in meteorology.

JF: We are going to do this a lot, but I am going to stop you. Because we work---

KS: Yes, we haven't even gotten to the question yet.

JF: ---I've got to---we've got to tell this story. I remember that you would go back to New Jersey to visit your parents, and um, you would do home modeling remodeling projects with your dad, and one day you were in a discussion about whether it was a tropical storm or a hurricane off the coast of---tell that story.

KS: Yes. Well, it was late in the season, like it was November, and there was an early season nor'easter brewing. Um, but it was it was one of it was a hybrid 3:00kind of storm. It has some tropical characteristics early on, but as---

JF: You would know this, but your dad wouldn't, but you would know this.

KS: You would think.

JF: Right.

KS: Um, and we got into a discussion which became actually kind of heated. And we were talking about and my dad was saying it was a hurricane, this storm, and I said no, dad, I mean you know a couple of months ago it would have become one perhaps because of where it originated, but I said now it's it is a nor'easter. It's just a big low pressure system. Anyway, back and forth we went until it got to a point I think I frustrated my dad because I kept saying no, dad, it's not a hurricane. And he sat there and said, "Well, what do you think you are? Some sort of an expert?"

JF: (laughs)

KS: And even my mom, who backed my dad, was always there beside him, even she 4:00had to laugh about that one (both laugh) because it was kind of like yeah, dad---

JF: As a matter of fact, I am. (both laugh)

KS: ---I think I am. (both laugh) Yes, so uh---

JF: So you're qualified for that.

KS: And I think he gave me that point, but he did not concede on the fact that this was---

JF: You were an expert, but he still didn't know that (??)

KS: ---yes, you know. It was a draw, but one of the few I had with dad, I considered it a victory.

JF: Okay, so you and your dad you became the expert, but you were scared of thunderstorms, so you went to---how did that lead to meteorology?

KS: Now, I'm talking as a child, you know, and it's just one of those things that uh, eventually, when you ask enough questions, uh, you are directed you get it in school there's a library. Library has books on this that and the other thing, and I was just taking any books that had clouds on it. You know, I couldn't read very well, but it was interesting.

JF: The pictures were nice.

KS: And there was a movie out, that had come to tv; it was call the Wizard of Oz. I don't know if you've ever seen that.

JF: I think I've heard of it, yes.

KS: You might have actually acted in it.

JF: (laughs)

KS: But, here was this storm they called a tornado, and I mean it was like that 5:00doesn't exist. And My dad says yes it does. And you get the gist of it.

JF: Yeah.

KS: There was enough out there to provoke curiosity. And so truly, it's one of those situations where an early fear turned out to be a career.

JF: I'll be darned.

KS: Now, let's go to the second part of that that equation. I had, uh I'd hate to say a deathly fear, but I had anxiety attacks if I had to speak in front of anybody, including my family. I had to say Thanksgiving Grace one time, and I thought it was going to end me---

JF: Really. Wow.

KS: ---because people will watch me, and they were listening to me, and so broadcasting was never ever in---

JF: Not even on the radar.

KS: ---it was something that I could not ever imagine doing because I truly feared it. I mean it was I did have anxiety attacks; you know when you had to do speeches in front of your classmates that was worth two three nights of sleeplessness.

JF: That's amazing.

KS: Um, that is that's true. I mean I am not making it up in the way of anxiety. It was it was that bad. I mean a kind of a crushing sensation in the chest and that sort of thing. Anyway, it just so happened that as I got out of college my soul ambition was to work for the National Weather Service. I just thought those folks were truly the people behind the curtain---

JF: Oh yeah?

KS: ---great, omnipotent Oz, you know these guys were weather people, meteorologists. And that was my that was my career choice and path, except for in 1974 when I graduated from college, the National Weather Service was downsizing. They were closing offices, um, they were taking people out of the 7:00closed offices and packing other offices. There was no availability, no room in the inn, literally. And so you had to cast a wider net, and it just so happens there's there are organizations out there that are called industrial meteorology, a private weather, and it's forecast for hire. And I just happened to catch the eye and ear of the owner of Great Lake Weather Service up in Green Bay, Wisconsin. Now, I'm from New Jersey. He actually called me to check my accent. He told me after the interview he said if you had a real strong Jersey accent, you know, he was going to thank me for interest and blow me off.

JF: Really. Wow.

KS: So the accent was okay and invited me up for an interview and eventually led to a job. Part of that job was doing radio broadcasting, and it was brutal. I mean---

JF: So the fear was still there.

KS: ---still there. You know I'm just getting comfortable with meteorology now. I loved the science, but this new aspect of what I've got to do. Long story short. You kind of find a midway point. You know you start feeling comfortable. Uh, and kind of outgrew the little weather service that I was working for. I had bigger ambitions at that time, and there are larger, private, weather services out there, so I went and uh was hired by a larger, more nationally known one in St. Louis.

JF: Okay.

KS: And that one was Weather Corporation. Same thing, business forecast for hire. A lot more forecasting---

JF: More opportunities and things, yeah.

KS: ---yeah. They had uh, utility companies from the east coast to the west; they there was about thirty radio stations, but there was also, you know, construction companies. There was a lot of industrial forecasting. Um, and and 9:00was there and again, this is where I'm going to be this is my life from this point on. Now, I'm sitting at home. And I'm twenty-four years old, and I'm watching this character on tv do weather, and normally I'm fine with that. I think everybody has a unique talent, but I think it was Cindy, somebody said to me are you ever going to try that, not do that, are you ever going to try doing tv weather. That was a, that's a bothersome word for me because now I've got to try. It was not a challenge; it was not a gauntlet thrown at my feet. It was literally just are you going to try to do that. And it's like you know what, I'm twenty-four if I don't try now um, thirty years from now I'll be wondering what if.

JF: Huh, interesting.

KS: And if I fail, I'm twenty-four, how bad (laughs) could have it be.

JF: Possible of starting, again.

KS: (laughs) There's a lot of opportunities. I'm newly married. We have no kids, you know, everything is nows the time to try. And I I sent out my resumes, and uh, there was one silly station in Louisville, Kentucky, who bit on one of my resumes. I had a couple of nibbles, but when they kept asking, when the question came up, well, what's your prior experience, it was rather slim.

JF: (laughs)

KS: And HAS said, "Well, I'll tell you what. We'll bring you down here. And we'll interview you. We want you to do an audition for radio and tv, because that's the position we're looking for, and if you are interested, let's do it." And so, you know, this is it; this may be it. And so now we pick up on your question. (laughs)

JF: You came over for an interview, and you're ready, you're coming over, and 11:00you're going to do your interview; go back to St. Louis.

KS: Yes. I mean how it's uh---

JF: Yeah, right.

KS: ---it's a hop skip---

JF: It's a 45-minute flight, yeah, sure.

KS: Yep, it it was, and and they said we're going we're going to fly you in; they booked me the arrangements. It was uh, basically, I got into the station at WHAS um, I think it was an August morning at 8:30.

JF: Eight thirty in the morning. You're home by noon.

KS: You know I'm seriously, well, and we had a flight out. They said we're not sure about schedules or anything, and so we'll book you for a flight out about five in the evening. I said, okay, that's cool. Because there's a lot of people who we want you to talk to, and. Okay, 8:30 in the morning, they brought me in, and I am primed. I mean I am---

JF: You're ready.

KS: ---I am so ready, you know it's like okay, this is my big chance. I'm prepped and got everything, and they said, "Okay now we're going to sit you here 12:00in the newsroom, and there's a couple of things couple meetings," the guy that was talking to me at that time---the guy who was talking to me at the time---I think he was like a program director of sorts. I've forgot the title that he had, but he said, "I've got a couple of meetings to go to, so uh, just sit here; I will be right back."

JF: And absorb things a little bit.

KS: Yes. And so, I am, "Yes, sir, absolutely, all this is exciting, sir."

JF: (laughs)

So I sat in the uh, news room from 8:30 to noon. (laughs)

JF: No action.

KS: No action. I have not seen the gentleman that has picked me up. I have not seen him. It is now they are doing the noon news, and finally, his name was George, the fellow that was shepherding me around. His name was George. George finally comes flying into the newsroom and says, "Ken, I'm sorry; I'm sorry. Let's go have a bite to eat."

"Sure, sir, yes, sir." Yeah, I am not quite as sharp as I was, but I'm still following instructions. So we go to, I think it was Kunzes---

JF: Oh, yeah, the old Kunzes.

KS: ---just two blocks down from the station---

JF: Yeah, the station was at sixth and Chestnut.

KS: Sixth and Chestnut, and so it was very nice, little walk, the weather was nice and all that. Sat down at the table, and I appreciated the lunch, and I even said to George, I said to George, "George, thank you." I said, "Now it's a chance to sit down and chat with you and and you know, this is very nice."

And he said, "Well, don't get real comfortable. I have to be back in the station in about twenty minutes; so we're going to have to eat quickly."

JF: (laughs)

KS: And it's like, oh, no conversation because now it's just a matter of consuming nourishment. (both laugh) It's a long haul before you get back to St. Louis. Stock up on that food. I'm stuffing bread sticks in my pocket. (both laugh)

KS: So anyway, so we didn't get anything accomplished at lunch, and I was back in the news room at 12:30, and George said very nicely, "I've got a couple more 14:00meetings; there's a lot going on right now. I apologize. But we still want get you to do an audition for radio and for tv," and he said, "it shouldn't be very long now," he said, "so so just be patient."

"Okay! George, I got a flight out at five."

"Yeah, yeah, oh, no problem."

Sat in the newsroom until 3:30. I had been there since 8:30 in the morning. I had indigestion from the lunch that was well eaten, but (laughs) so I'm sitting there at 3:30, and finally George makes this appearance, and says, "Oh, we're kind of running tight on time. I want you to come and talk to the radio news director, because really you're going to be working under him."

JF: This was, uh, Glen Bastin.

KS: Glen Baston. And I'll say this upfront. We became great friends, and I 15:00admired Glen and all that. But this is the interview day; I had not met Glen. So, I walked into---

JF: He had probably not been through what you had been through today.

KS: ---no.

JF: He probably didn't know who you are.

KS: He probably saw this skinny, fuzzy - cheeked kid sitting in the newsroom and wondering what, gosh, what are we hiring, a high school kid? So I walked into Glen's office, sat down and had a little bit of a chat with Glen. And Glen was very very, um, conscientious about the news product going out on radio. Very conscientious.

JF: News cast coming up soon.

KS: Yup. And he was very much involved, and he sat there, and at one point he kind of leaned back in his chair, as if it were a much bigger chair than he had, I mean it was it was, and he said, "Well, while you're here, why don't you prepare me a forecast." And he did this with this little twirling hand.

JF: You can still see it today. (both laugh)

KS: And I'm still doing it. Too bad this isn't video, Jack. So I'm sitting 16:00there, and I 'm looking at him, and by now I have just about had it. You know, I had been sitting in the newsroom since 8:30 in the morning. Well now it's about quarter to four. I have a flight out at five. And here's this guy I've never met all of a sudden, with my hand twirling in the air, prepare him a forecast. And I said, politely enough I thought, "I would have been glad to have done this for you anytime over the last six hours, but I'll tell you what, since I don't know you either, why don't you" and that would be Glen, "why don't you just prepare me a newscast," and I waved my hand just like he did---(laughs)

JF: Interviewing you for the job.

KS: Yes, he's going to be my boss. I'm sorry. You got the picture, at this point it was like George, who was in on the action, I thought, the way he reacted, I think he thought we were going to get into a fight, and wouldn't in no way shape 17:00or form was it ever going to become physical, but George jumps up, "Whoa whoa whoa whoa, Ken, um, maybe if you could just do a simulated weather broadcast for radio."

And I said, "Well, I thought that's what I was supposed to be doing in the first place. I would be glad to do that. So, in the meantime, you know, let me just knock this one out, and if you want me to prepare you a forecast, I would be glad to come back some other day." I said you have to realize I'm making forecasts for businesses and industries that are putting lots of money on every word that I say, so I do make forecasts. I do it for critical situations every day. This is not one of those. And it takes me hours to prepare a forecast, and I would not do you or me any justice by just pretending I am coming up with a forecast. That's how we kind of left it. But I don't think Glen was terribly impressed with me at that point and time. And let me say I wasn't terribly with Glen at that point and time. So I knocked out the radio portion of the the 18:00interview, and then they ran me into the tv studio, and Jim Mitchell---

JF: Anchorman.

KS: ---anchorman, very much respected. He was the guy that was going to give me the pretend pitch to weather, and I was going to have a chit chat with him on the anchor desk, and so he was my cop-pilot on this one, and we ran into the news studio---I have never seen the news studio---I have never seen the weather set up---they showed me---

JF: You've been sitting in the weather room, in the news room.

KS: ---I'd been sitting in the, yeah, for six hours. Did I say that?

JF: (laughs)

KS: I mean there were switches to flip, and there were boards to spin, and George said, "You're going to have to do this in one take. We're running out of time." (both laugh) I'm sorry, it is just---so I I bumbled and rumbled through my tv interview, came out back into the news room---

JF: It was close to five o'clock by now.

KS: ---it is now past four. And I am just like please, you know, just let's put a fork in this, and call it done.

"Now, we want you to talk with the General Manager of WHAS."

And at that time WHAS radio and tv were one.

JF: Yeah, um hum.

KS: There was one general manager. And his name was Brad Osler, nice guy, uh, you know he was he was in the newsroom. They had they had thought ahead---

JF: (laughs) This time.

KS: ---(laughs) and asked him to come downstairs. But, there was no place to talk. And we're standing in the newsroom---

JF: In the newsroom they are getting ready for a five o'clock news cast.

KS: That's right, and you know how that is, and uh, so finally someone says we can talk back here in the, in the, uh, file room. And so file room. So it's the little room off the newsroom where they have all filing cabinets and boxes of old scripts (both laugh), and they said, "Sit on one." (laughs) This is my interview.

JF: Make yourself at home.

KS: I sat on a box of old scripts, paper sticking out the side. Fred, the General Manager, is sitting on this old metal desk; they didn't even have a chair, and he's sitting there, and people are just kind of up against the wall listening in, and we had and we conducted this interview in like five minutes. And Fred says, "So, George, what do you think?"

And George goes, "I think we should hire him."

I am like, are you kidding me? Have you been with me all that, I'm thinking that---I haven't said it, but I am just kind of looking at George, and I said, "Don't you need to talk to Mr. Bastin, who I don't think I've really impressed since I'm going to be working for him?"

"Oh, no, no, no, that'll be all right."

Anyway, condense the goodbyes. I get on the plane. I fly back home. I get into our apartment, and Cindy is like anxiously awaiting word--this is days before cell phones. There wasn't the immediate communications. So, Cindy is sitting at home waiting breathlessly for for for news, and at this point we are expecting 21:00our first child, and so I walk in, and she goes, "Well tell me all about it." And I did.

JF: Just like you told me.

KS: Even longer.

JF: (laughs)

KS: And she stops me before the end and goes, "Ken, don't be upset. Don't be downhearted. There will be other opportunities. This is just the first time. Don't don't beat yourself up."

I said, "Cindy, they offered me the job."

JF: (laughs)

KS: And her next remark was, "And you will take it? Are you kidding me? You would want to work for that organization?" That's like, well, you know beggars 22:00can't be choosers. So that is that is the story of how I accepted, and you know what it really kind of colored my entire career at HAS. It was bazaar at times, funny, made a great made-for-tv movie in my own mind---

JF: (laughs)

KS: ---but the characters that I was thrown in with. It really kind of set the pace, and as I said I worked with Glen Bastin for I don't know how many years.

JF: As the news director, uh hum.

KS: And we were--I mean, I respected his news decisions. He respected my weather opinions. We got along great, but that interview could not have gone worse.

JF: You know it just occurred to me though, uh, Fred Osler was the fellow who said let's hire you; he was gone in six months., wasn't he.(laughs).

KS: Yeah, six months later (laughs); yeah, (laughs) he was gone, and then the new general manager had no clue why would they would have fired me in the first place. (both laugh) And like I said, kind of set the tone for thirty years.

JF: Thirty years. That's amazing. From 1978 to 2008, wow.

KS: Two thousand eight.

JF: So now were you were you doing both radio and television? Are you, were you, Glen was your boss, so you were in radio technically or uh?

KS: Remember we were one big happy family.

JF: Yeah.

KS: But, there were different budgets, and so what eventually happened---Glen wanted a meteorologist on in the mornings.

JF: Because they were just really starting to carve out a really presence on WHAS Radio at that time, weren't they?

KS: Exactly.

JF: Uh, Wayne Perkey was was, yeah, Perkey was doing the morning.

KS: Oh, the cast of characters. I mean, Wayne Perkey was the morning DJ. Yes, his name is Perkey. Uh, and he was. Um, sometimes incredibly so, but that's---

JF: Was your first assignment doing morning radio, doing weather on morning radio, or what were you doing?

KS: ---my my job entailed Monday through Friday, morning drive-time radio, and 24:00Saturday evening weather on tv.

JF: Huh.

KS: Uh, it was a six-day work week.

JF: You know, I have to realize that I thought that you'd come for television and kind of splashed over to radio. It was kind of the other way around.

KS: Glen wanted somebody, uh, I say Glen, that that's was my immediate superior, there, uh but somebody wanted a local voice and not a canned voice.

JF: Um-hm.

KS: No a weather service---

JF: Yeah, like you, yeah.

KS: --who working out of Pennsylvania doing the weather. They wanted a live voice, like they had a live voice doing traffic, Dick Gilbert.

JF: Dick Gilbert, yeah, uh-huh

KS: Um, and so---

JF: Putting all those elements in there.

KS: ---one of the radio stations weather stations to do that to hire their own meteorologist, so to speak. But, I wasn't just radio. I was radio and tv. Radio is where I answered, and tv was where Chuck Taylor---

JF: Okay, so Chuck was the weather on television?

KS: Chuck was there two years before I was.

JF: Who were the other did they have other weather people there at that time?

KS: Nope.

JF: Just the two of you? I know, some others came along---

KS: He was the first meteorologist. Chuck was the first to be hired. I was the second. I believe it was Gary Rizzo, the third meteorologist.

JF: Is that right?

KS: We we stayed a long time.

JF: You did, yeah.

KS: And so, uh, getting into the nineties there was there had only been three hires, and we were all still working there.

JF: Yeah, that's amazing. Well, now, what were mornings like doing morning radio with Wayne Perkey and you had prepared your forecast, and tell let's talk about that a little bit.

KS: Okay. Go back to WHAS was the unique experience from the git- go. They hired me. They did, and I accepted. I did, and I came to work, uh, it was like September 6th or something was my first day. I don't know. Somebody can check a calendar and find out if it was a Monday or not, and uh, I supposed to go on the air at five o'clock in the morning with my first forecast. And I walk into the radio studio, and there's Wayne. And Wayne is just this exuberant, you know. "Hi. Wayne Perkey."

JF: You hadn't met before?

KS: (laughs) Nah, we had not met.

JF: Wow.

WP: Well, um, the interview process---(laughs)

JF: Wayne wasn't in that line---couldn't work Wayne in.(laughs) By that time of day he was long gone.

KS: It would have been swell if we could have. (both laugh) So I walked in, and Wayne was behind the the console and said, "Hi, Wayne Perkey, and who the heck are you and what are you doing in my studio?" (both laugh) Nobody had told them---

JF: Wow.

KS: ---that A. I was coming on board, but B. what was I going to do? (laughs) Nobody had said hey, Wayne, we (laughs) hired a meteorologist to do weather for us.

JF: Who was the news guy when you were doing that? Do you remember who that was?

KS: Uh, in the morning, Mark Watkins.

JF: Okay.

KS: Mark Watkins, I believe was doing the, uh, the news at that time. And I think he was a recent hire. I say that, and somebody can go back in the Archives and prove me wrong, but that's what I remember, so there.

JF: Everything was new to you.

KS: And fear.

JF: Yeah, now you you're fearful at this time?

KS: Oh, gosh, yes. In fact, you know what honestly stayed fearful through thirty years, to a certain degree.

JF: Yeah.

KS: I was always anxious.

JF: Not the panic, yeah, but not the panic attacks.

KS: But, very anxious, uh, about you've got two and a half minutes to make your plea.

JF: Wow.

KS: You better have it down right. And so I I always felt the pressure to to perform. And I did not, initially I thought that was terrible, but over the course of the years I embraced that. Uh, because it keeps you really sharp. When you think you can screw up, and you know you're walking on a precipice, you're very very alert. And, uh, I wasn't all that good, (both laugh) and so that like everybody in broadcasting, "When are they going to fire me." Always looking over your shoulder. I think it really worked to my advantage in some ways. It 28:00probably took twenty years off my life, but it worked, I think---

JF: Well, you don't look seventy-four, so you're (laughs)

KS: ---thank you, Jack, that was unkind, but also very common from you.

JF: (laughs)

KS: So, Wayne, Wayne actually we became good friends. Uh, just a tremendous amount of respect for Wayne because he carved out time on his show; if he was an egotist uh, he could have blocked me; he could have blocked anybody. It's his show. It's the Wayne Perkey show. It wasn't Wayne Perkey and company at the time or whatever; it was Wayne's show, and he was the star. But, he allowed people to come in and participate, and he was also smart enough to realize that it was good stuff. Uh, took a little while to get all the people in place, but we had Fred Wichy, Barney Arnold---

JF: The farm thing Bar, Fred, Wichy, Dick who was doing the traffic. Had your dad called to remind you this this time that you were an expert. Had your dad called? (both laugh)

KS: ---about this time, yeah, (both laugh) yeah, my ego was taking some flak for not really being the smoothest broadcaster on the air. Yeah, Dad was a shoring up all that other stuff. You're not an expert. Yes, I am. No you're not. (laughs) Pretending to be. The real experts are on tv here in Philadelphia.

JF: (laughs)

KS: Oh, I didn't know that.

JF: Say in this cast of characters though, you had uh Barney and Fred.

KS: Oh, listen. Let's go back to the fact of a twenty-four-year-old, fuzzy-cheeked kid. Truly, my first you could see some of my first promo pictures.

JF: And this is not a beginner radio station or television station.

KS: That's the point. This is this is the fifty thousand watt blow torch, lovingly referred to this is the home of Cawood Ledford; this is the home of 30:00Barney Arnold; this is the home of Phyllis Knight, shall I go on, I mean, you know just all already hall of famers, and here---

JF: You're stepping in here.

KS: ---you know, who could barely say his name, without having some sort of anxiety attack. And it it there was a lot of pressure. There really was, and there was occasions where I'd could hear myself cracking under it, but that was--those were my tutors, Jack Fox---um, well okay, maybe not.

JF: Careful, careful, careful.

KS: But, I'm just saying, Barney Arnold was the uh, was the Farm Director. And he when I first showed up on radio, he had just had uh, a heart attack, and he was out; so I did not work with him immediately. In fact, when he came back he kind of came back on a part-time basis, and eventually just retired. Um, I can remember talking to Barney the first time. I walked into his office, and introduced myself. He was back from his uh, medical leave, and I said, "Hey, Barney, my name's Ken Schulz. I'm the uh, the morning meteorologist uh, that they 31:00hired, and and I've heard so much about you, and and uh, just wanted to come in and say hi, and what do you think about about the station hiring a morning meteorologist."

And Barney, the nicest man in the world sat back in his chair and said, "I don't think much about it. (both laugh) I don't see it; I don't get it, but you know what, that's not my call. (both laugh) So welcome." (both laugh)

So, I said, "Okay."

KS: Wow.

JF: Barney, that was Barney, that was Barney.

KS: Oh, and let me emphasize, again, it was not said in that nasty way. I asked the question, and he just answered it.

JF: (laughs)

KS: He was honest as the day was long. But, but when you think of my tutors there was Barney. Now, I didn't work with him long, but Fred Wichy was his replacement, and again, we're talking an icon, here. So I worked with Fred. Wayne Perkey we've already mentioned, uh, Dick Gilbert, and for those who 32:00remember him, you know, he was the champion of the '74 tornado outbreak. Phyllis Knight, who made her impact, not only locally, but nationally, I mean, she had uh something to say to me from time to time. Cawood Ledford, who gave me great advice---don't show up on Fridays; that's when they fire people---

JF: (laughs)

KS: ---no, I'm serious. He---

JF: (laughs)

KS: ---he brought me inside one time, to tell me that.

JF: (laughs)

KS: Uh, but the news people, I mention, like the Jim Mitchells, the Kirsty Wildes, the Chuck Taylors.

JF: Yeah.

KS: Those were the tutors that this fuzzy-cheeked, twenty-four-year-old, mind full of mush, if I can use somebody else's analogy, those were the people that shaped my early career.

JF: You mentioned when we were when the mic wasn't on the other day we were talking much with your encounter with Phyllis Knight, tell me about that and her advice. Everybody had some advice for you.

KS: I was I was the new kid on the block before there were The New Kids on the Block. I was the the low man on the totem pole. I was the fuzzy-cheeked kid. And I kind of had a job description that was a little bit wide. I was the morning radio meteorologist, but you know what, if there's any kind of severe weather you're staying for as long as there's that threat. Obviously.

JF: So, at this point there's just you and Chuck.

KS: Chuck Taylor. And uh, on weekend, we we had tv programing, but you know what, sometimes weather turn on Sunday, too.

JF: Yeah.

KS: And although we didn't have a news cast; tv did not have a news cast on Sunday until 11:00 in the evening, and then it was only fifteen minutes long. That's how---

JF: Wow, wow.

KS: ---so they gave me that day off, unless there was weather. So there were times you could work weeks, you know, morning, early morning, noon, night. I mean you're just---well, I was twenty-four, and learning, and I was grateful to 34:00to be where I was. Anyway, I'm walking down the hall one day after a particularly long stretch of time um that I had been on the air in some fashion or form, maybe even filling in for Chuck, you know he might have been sick, but there was a stretch in time I was there constantly---

JF: Eighteen, twenty hours a day.

KS: ---and Phyllis was walking up the hall. And here is this, you know, very prim, proper, matriarch of broadcasting. And we get we're approaching each other, and she kinds of grabs me by the shirt and throws me up against the wall. Now, I say throw---

JF: (laughs)

KS: ---now I say throw, I wasn't fighting back, you know, but you know she kind of just wields me around and pushed me up against the wall. And she said, "What 35:00are you doing?" And I'm thinking, well, right now I'm now I'm trying to keep my knees from knocking, (both laugh) Phyllis, I don't know what. I, what, I I don't know did I do something wrong, I mean, what did I say, you know. And she says, "Listen, you cannot keep working like this. They are not going to put a statute of you in the lobby," that time we had that uh, pond----

JF: Oh, yeah.

KS: ---the fountain.

JF: Fountain.

KS: (laughs)--- "they are not going to take the fountain out and replace it with a statue of Ken Schulz. If you let 'em, they'll kill ya. I mean you they will work you to the bone. Say no!"

JF: Wow.

KS: And this is from Phyllis Knight, and I just sat there, and my jaw dropped and everything, and she said, basically after that she said have a good day, and she walked on. But, but her point was you know you can only do so much, and then after a while, it not only affects you your health, it also affects your production.

JF: Yeah.

KS: And maybe I, who knows, I mean after a couple of weeks of early mornings late nights seven days a week, perhaps I was going on the air and babbling on, as they said, the ramblings of an idle mind. Maybe it might have been the first opportunity to do that on radio, on fifty-thousand-watt radio station---

JF: Laughs.

KS: ---and Phyllis picked up on it.

JF: That's wild. We had some interesting people to work with a lot of time. Let me ask you---

KS: And great advice, too, all of them.

JF: ---you, um, you your first forecast was at five o'clock in the morning, but you didn't just walk in and rip stuff off the wire. What time did you get in; what time did you start; how much preparation for that first forecast?

KS: Well, you know, I carried over the same work philosophy, uh, philosophy, that wasn't the right word, basically what I was told to do in my other jobs. (both laugh) Uh, I carried that over into broadcasting. Um, in my private industrial days uh, your first forecast might have gone out at three thirty in 37:00the morning. Who knows? It might have been---

JF: Sure, depending on the industry what they needed.

KS: Yup. Like the Atlantic Electric Power, AEP uh, was was a big one that we had along the eastern seaboard. And they might have needed their forecast at three thirty in the morning; who knows. And, it was at that point in time you as a meteorologist, you have to come in you plot your own maps. This was kind of in the days as we're going from hand plotting to computer, but it wasn't---

JF: Still a lot to do, yeah, yeah.

KS: ---and so there was a lot of hand plotting to do; so you got in at midnight to do a forecast for three thirty in the morning. And I kind of carried over that same time frame. I'm not going on the air unprepared. If there's anything I have, initially going into this, it's not my broadcast savvy it's my forecasting savvy.

JF: Um hm.

KS: So, I'm going to make sure I've got all the t's crossed and i's dotted. So I 38:00got in like three o'clock in the morning, and worked two hours to get the forecast, and of course, you had to type it up, and you had to prep people or explain things to some of the news people. And do all of that, and so---

JF: What were your sources for information at that time.

KS: ---the uh, uh---

JF: And had the computer or a---

KS: ---WHAS, though, had all the facsimile machines that we needed. We had a fax machine that printed out the weather maps that came from the National Weather Service.

JF: Weather Service, yeah.

KS: We had the teletypes. Again, that information came from NOAA, the National Weather Service. Uh, we had a local teletype. We had a a more of a meteorological let's spit out some garbage here that nobody but can read, but meteorology, uh, meteorologists, so we had that. We hacked, and we had radar. WHAS owned its own radar; it was the Action Track Color Radar.

JF: I remember that.

KS: It was the first colorized radar in this area. So, we had that.

JF: So you had to consider all that in in the consult information as you're preparing.

KS: Yes, exactly. And it's just more than saying hey, it's going to be a sunny day today, because you were in to a five-day forecast even then. Now, we're doing, what? Twelve, fifteen days---

JF: Yeah.

KS: ---okay, you know, wink wink, let's all believe that one. But, you know there was not just today's forecast, there was today, tonight, tomorrow, and the next three or four days. And it is a process to do that. Granted in the summer time, you can knock out a hazy, hot, and humid forecast in less than two hours, but in the winter time when you are dealing with the, you know, the potential for snow, sleet, rain, freezing rain, thunder storms, all of that; it took all of two hours, if not more.

JF: That first morning you walked in you didn't the newsman said, here's the weather and you did your weather forecast in what thirty seconds or some, how long did you do your weather forecast, and was that the end? Did Wayne say something to you afterwards? Or when did, I guess what I'm trying to, when did it start uh, because you became an integral part of that program, uh, when did 40:00it when did that happen? When you went from just giving the forecast, and then Wayne would say well, wait a minute let's talk about this. Did that happen gradually or when did that happen?

KS: You know, that's a I've never been asked that question, and I don't have a definite answer.

JF: Or was it there from the start?

KS: I think it it morphed, but Wayne was always Wayne. Um, for those that know Wayne Perkey probably understand that definition. Nobody was going to escape his studio without being introduced, tell us a little about yourself, uh, you, know---

JF: Yeah, right, yeah.

KS: --- bring something to the table by golly, because you're in my studio.

JF: Yeah, yeah.

KS: He never said it that way, but that's that's kind of the way it felt is, you know, yeah, you're invited, sit down, please can I get you coffee, but let's get something from you, too. So, it might not have happened right at that five 41:00o'clock the first one, but at 5:20.

JF: Yeah.

KS: I came back to do just weather because we did weather about every twenty minutes---

JF: Yeah, yeah.

KS: ---well, I mean on the hour, half hour---

JF: Yeah. You'd stop in twenty till, and ten till, and twenty after ten till and---

KS: ---yeah, about four or five times an hour.

JF: ---fill in some of the details, and everything, yeah. And that's where the personality started coming in.

KS: Twenty after was the first time that he said, "Well, okay, well, we are introducing somebody new today to our staff, to our family here," and that was the first opportunity.

JF: You didn't tell him about the job interview, did you. (laughs)

KS: I did not tell. I did not mention that job interview.

JF: (laughs)

KS: Even to Glen Bastin until about like thirty years later.

JF: (laughs)

KS: We had a big anniversary get together, and it's like, Glen do you remember. He had forgotten it, but I I never will.

JF: He had other things on his mind there. That's amazing. Really interesting. Well, that also that style that Wayne had uh, that made you a personality I mean because he began to talk about you, about your wife, Cindy, about your kids, and all that sort of thing. About you going home and helping your dad remodel, all that stuff came out. That was part of the fabric of the show.

KS: Because that's what he did.

JF: And that was okay with you?

KS: Oh, absolutely. In fact, that took the pressure off.

JF: And did that help you ease from those anxiety moments? Of course I know you'd come a long way from where you were as a kid. Did that make you more at ease and everything.

KS: It oh, the times we could converse like that, oh absolutely. It's nothing more than what we are doing right now. Ignore the microphone; I can talk to you about whatever you want to talk about as long as you want to hear. And so Wayne, not just me, but Wayne brought that out in uh, well, me, but he didn't need much help with Dick Gilbert. Dick was (laughs) kind of already there. Um, but he made the news person outside the news. No, in the news, in weather, you're the professional. Don't mess around. Outside of those arenas uh, now we have a 43:00chance to talk, and that's where the news guy got to to infuse his personality. Uh, sports, uh, you know read the scores, yep, tell us about the highlights of last night's game. You better. But, then afterwards brought everybody in to talk about well what'd you do over the weekend?

JF: Yeah, that made uh, that made it.

KS: And then made it more palatable not just to us, but I think to the listening audience. If there's one thing I remember about five o'clock in the morning or five thirty in the morning---five thirty is when we start the Farm Show--

JF: Yeah, oh, yeah.

KS: --- five thirty to six thirty, and you know at this point we're kind of moving away a little bit from a lot of farm programming to some farm programming and what not.

JF: More urban information, yeah.

KS: More urban, absolutely. Um, but we had people were doctors, lawyers, 44:00teachers, uh, listening to the farm program because of what we were just talking about. Uh, yep, Fred tell us about the barrows and gilts and and then afterwards, you know, tell up what is going on the farm.

JF: Yeah, uh huh.

KS: And and we would have these gab session, I mean, we were like the gossipy neighbors talking on a 50,000-watt radio station pretending nobody else is out there listening. I mean more or less just kind of round table discussion, and anything was game.

JF: Yeah. There were, now you mentioned getting out across the country across the country. Did you ever hear from anybody from New Jersey who knew you or, uh, or listening or have any feedback from any of those people?

KS: (laughs) You'd have to know, you'd have to know my family. But, my my folks, my my roots are in the Philadelphia New York area, New Jersey. And we're very 45:00blunt people, and we can be very colorful in our language. We can be downright blue, if you know what I mean. (laughs) All right, so there was a moment in time where I'm in the news room, and somebody come running into the news room, and says, "Ken, Ken, Wayne has your brother on the air." And I am like oh my Gosh, this could be really really bad if Wayne's not careful.

JF: Because your brother is your dad's son, also. (laughs)

KS: My brother is is yes, absolutely. Howard, Jr. to be exact.

JF: (laughs)

KS: Howard did not mince words. I mean he would you would come on and say, "How the f--- are you?" you know, and that would be--- that's my fear is is Wayne's got him on a hold during a commercial and hasn't really done anything with Howard. I go, I mean, racing down into the studio. "Wayne, have you put Howard 46:00on the air, yet."

"No, no, we're just going to do it."

"Put me on first." (laughs)

So Wayne flips the switches; the commercial ends, and, "Ken, we have a surprise guest."

And without anything else, I just say, "Howard, you're on the air live."

JF: (laughs)

KS: And there's this long pause, and Howard goes, "Well, that just took about a third of my conversation."

(both laugh)

KS: I knew it. (laughs) I knew it. But, Howard was going to work in New Jersey. It was pre-dawn, and that's 50,000 watt-radio station, clear channel---

JF: That's amazing.

KS: We boomed out over forty some states, including New Jersey, so.

JF: I'll be damned.

KS: Yeah, a little taste of home then.

JF: Yeah. Did you get other calls like that from, uh other people around the over the years, uh, did you?

KS: Not a whole lot. My dad and mom when they would come out to visit. They'd leave bright and early on a, you know, because it took eleven hours to drive, and so they would listen---

JF: Oh, yeah, nice, nice.

KS: ---so they would listen to the morning show until it faded out in daylight, and so they would comment.

JF: Yeah.

KS: Uh, but, you know, it was uh it was it was always fun, and there was a couple of people who had moved here from South Jersey or or and and knew I was from that area---

JF: That you had some ties.

KS: ---so I had a lot of conversations with them. But, you know, I I would be remiss if I didn't mention, again, you know, everybody played a part. I told you about Phyllis Knight kind of slapping some sense in side of my head. I told you about Barney Arnold, you know, let's just be honest, you know. (laughs) Cawood, the "don't show up on Friday"; (laughs) here's this icon--- that was his advice to me, and I I still remember it. Now, Wayne, of course, was was Mr. Personality. I, you know, he really showed the fuzzy-cheeked kid, um, how to talk to people. He was very open.

JF: Yeah, he was very good at that. He was a people person. Community person.

KS: And nobody is an enemy, unless they make themselves that. You accept people for what they are. And uh, you welcome, and and I learned a whole lot about 48:00off-air antics from Wayne. I mean just how he interacted with people. I mean it was a study.

JF: You know, you don't know this, but the first day I went to work in 1973, I walked into this building, and I walk the announcer's room was back about well, as far south west corner of the building, and I walk in and, there's this guy, tall, skinny, guy, the only guy who walks in, he says, "Hi, I'm Wayne Perkey." Same thing.

KS: Yep. (laughs)

JF: Same thing, yeah. First guy I met.

KS: "Who are you---

JF: Yeah, right. Exactly.

KS: ---and what are you doing in my office?"

JF: Exactly right, yeah.

KS: (laughs) But, I also want to mention, and Dick Gilbert, of course, you know, had just, he was---

JF: Oh that was some time, when you and Gilbert and Perkey were going great.

KS: ---what what a funny guy, and but he knew his stuff. I mean, I don't know, I'm I'm always conscientious of time, but Dick Gilbert told me about his interview.

JF: Oh, really?

KS: Uh, he walked in, and they were interviewing, talking about having a traffic tracker. Um, and Dick walked into the boss's office, took off his watch, put it 49:00on the table, and boss is kind of looking at him, and Dick said, "If I can't convince you in two minutes, we've got nothing else to say."

JF: Is that right?

KS: And the rest is history. I also want to mention, too, something about Fred Wichy, and that is, um, Fred was exactly the way Fred seemed. I mean there was no---in fact most everybody I worked with at HAS people would ask that question all the time. What are they really like after, when they get away from the microphone. And they've moved away from the uh, the tv camera. And by and large, 98% of them were just like they were. Uh, Fred, obviously included. But what I want to say about Fred. He instilled a thought with me that still prevalent at this time. I was having a kind of a bad day. Oh, whatever reason. My my lead 50:00pencil broke. I don't know what made it a bad day, but I was making it a bad day. And Fred, at that time, just kind of you know just stopped me who was in a commercial break, and said, "Ken, no matter how bad you think today is, these are your good old days. So, really enjoy them. In twenty thirty years from now, you'll look back at this time and say that's the best it was."

JF: Wow.

KS: So, sorry about your day, but just keep in perspective. Always did, and he was dead on.

JF: That's the way he lived his life. He wasn't--he was always like that.

KS: I mean he just put a whole new spin on the day. Uh, and stuck with me to this day. I mean as bad as it gets, you know really it's really not all that bad. Back then, especially, at twenty-four, how bad could it be. And he was kind 51:00of telling me.

JF: Interesting.

KS: He just say, "Ease up on the gas."

JF: Just a little bit.

KS: "You're okay, and this is as good as it will ever be." And it was. Those were the I spent like eighteen twenty years of those thirty doing morning radio with Wayne and Fred and uh, and that was the high light---

JF: I'll be darn.

KS: ---yes, I was on tv, yes, I was the chief meteorologist, but the highlight of the broadcast era of Ken Schulz was---

JF: How about that.

KS: ---those eighteen years.

JF: Yes, good times. Um, who was the who was the um, radio program director and radio station manager when you came. Do you remember that?

KS: You know, I should.

JF: Was Hugh Barr still there when you came, or was he gone?

KS: You know I think Hugh was gone; Jerry David Melloy was the program director.

JF: Okay, un huh.

KS: And even Jerry David, uh, gave me some great advice about wearing your 52:00emotion on your sleeve---

JF: Hum, interesting.

KS: ---in broadcasting. Having a bad day--similar to Fred, having a bad day-- sorry, I don't want to hear it on my radio station. He was right. Nobody wants to hear that. You know, I mean, they want to hear the radio, people tune in for radio. They want to be entertained, and yet some folks would carry their whatever, their unhappiness right to the microphone. Who wants to hear that? Jerry David was the one that kind of slapped---

JF: How about that.

KS: ---some sense into me on that. But, he was program director. He'd have to run through some other names, uh, but I can't---

JF: I was not there during that period. I came back in '76, just before you got, and came back in '84, so---

KS: Yeah, I'm drawing a blank.

JF: ---Bill Campbell was in there then, or uh---

KS: Bill--

JF: ---Bill Campbell.

KS: ---Bill came to to be while I was there.

JF: Uh huh.

KS: But, who predated him, that that's one of those questions that I, you know, if this was a million-dollar game show I would have to phone a friend.

JF: (laughs) Well, let's talk about some of the news people that you worked with during that time. You were, now, you came you were on at various times of the day after a while. You weren't just morning. You were on various times; then later you even did some afternoon stuff. You became, uh. So who were some of the news people you worked with. Do you remember that? Uh.

KS: I mention a name right off the bat a name I never thought I would draw on---Mark Watkins. He was the he was the first, I think, morning uh person. Glen Bastin eventually became the morning newscaster, but it took some years. Jerry Litsell---

JF: Yeah.

KS: ---uh, incredible wit, uh, fun guy. Uh.

JF: But Burgess and uh Mike uh, whatever, those guys---

KS: Dan Burgess---

JF: ---Chuck, was Paddock still there? Or Paddock Chuck Paddock had gone by then.

KS: ---no. Chuck Paddock had left, uh, prior to---

JF: Dan Burgess and they had uh, Mary Jeffries---

KS: ---Mary Jeffries---

JF: ---Mary Jeffries, Mary McCarthy; some people like that.

KS: ---Oh gosh, yes. There was---

JF: Because you were afternoons, also, so you had a lot of people---

KS: ---depending on the day. (laughs)

JF: ---well that's true, that's right, yeah.

KS: After---

JF: Yeah, they did.

KS: --- after I pressed the caller down after Phyllis Knight, you know, said to me, "Don't let them do that to you." Okay, all right Phyllis, I got it. Uh, you know, your day was whatever your day had to be. And the other thing, too, is in '78 you were still kind of operating under the the 60's format when news played.

JF: Um hum.

KS: And what radio stations did; you didn't have all talk.

JF: Yeah, that's right.

KS: You had to get six records in a half hour, and you know, you had to mix them up, and you had to have male female artists, and you know, you had (laughs) all these standards, still.

JF: Yeah, yeah.

KS: Uh, tv had a six o'clock news cast and an eleven o'clock news cast. Noon, I mean, but they didn't have morning.

JF: Yeah.

KS: They had three news casts a day. Uh, weekends, is as I told you, Sunday you had a fifteen-minute news cast at eleven o'clock. Uh, so that's that evolved. And as that evolved so did your day. And news became uh a little bit longer in the morning. It was no longer than just five minutes. Like seven o'clock it went on almost fifteen, you know, and you filled it. You filled it with weather, sports, and news. Um, and filled these blocks up in radio you took away the music. So now you are only playing one or two pieces of music every half hour, and then finally somebody said why even bother---

JF: That's right.

KS: ---let's do all talk, and so that really, uh, captured your day because you were studio bound from five to ten. I mean I ran in and out a lot, but I mean, basically five times an hour.

JF: You know not only the weather as the station got even more involved with events, you began to give forecasts for the state fair, for going to Albuquerque for a Final Four.

KS: Yep.

JF: All that kind of thing, yeah.

KS: And then tv, which I was doing some. They wanted a meteorologist at noon time. Wayne Perkey was the weather guy that did news. Dick Gilbert was the weekend weather guy.

JF: Really.

KS: Until I got there.

JF: The helicopter pilot.

KS: Dick Gilbert, the helicopter pilot eventually said I'm not doing weekends anymore, and that's another reason I came along. Uh, Wayne, again, just happened we got a meteorologist in house let's use him at noon.

JF: Because Wayne had done weather in Mobile, Alabama. He was not a meteorologist, but he had done television weather, yeah. Huh. Interesting.

KS: And so I started to do that. Now my day used to end at end at 10:00, not it's going til 12:30 because it is a half hour news cast. But, you know what they do at that noon day? They expanded it to an hour. Now you're there until 1:00 or 1:30 in the afternoon, and then they, I for wait, they started at 5:00 and 5:30 news cast in the evening. They threw a 10:00 news cast in eventually there, too. We're all talk on radio; we're almost all talk on tv. So your day---

JF: About time for another talk from Phyllis. (laughs)

KS: ---yeah, it really, but you know what? I mentioned snippets of influence, you know what has said. Now, does Phyllis walk down the hall all the time and throw people, no. But, there was a point to be made, and she made it.

JF: She made it.

KS: And she stays with me. Fred Wichy stays with me. Wayne, obviously, Cawood. All these people uh, remember I'm wide open to their influence.

JF: Yeah.

KS: And it was good influence. I mean they were top notch people, and I just, Wayne always used to tell me, "You don't realize that you stepped into something good." And he was right.

JF: How about that?

KS: I mean just call it what you will, uh, I wouldn't say it's divine providence, I honestly think it was just luck.

JF: That is pretty remarkable to go for your first broadcast job to a situation like that and be there for thirty years.

KS: Thirty years.

JF: Yeah, that's impressive, very impressive, so so you worked with a variety of 58:00disc jockeys, also. Are we announcers, whatever you want to call them. You, Burbank wasn't there when you were there.

KS: Gary Burbank.

JF: Did you do some with Gary?

KS: Absolutely---

JF: All that had to be a hoot.

KS: ---oh gosh.

JF: That had to be a hoot.

KS: ---snow sharks---

JF: Oh, that's right the snow sharks.

KS: ---I was in--not involved in that, but that was my era. Uh, I did some voices for his show.

JF: Really.

KS: Until Glen Bastin found out.

JF: (laughs)

KS: He said, you know, news people don't do that. (both laugh) And he was right. (both laugh) I mean it was a credibility thing. I'm just saying nowadays no one would think about it; no one would blink an eye lash about that. Back then the credibility issue was was paramount; and you know you didn't do anything blue humor, you didn't say anything that---

JF: Commercials, you didn't do commercials.

KS: --no, I I, like I said, I did a little voice work, and Glen put an end to 59:00that. And rightfully so. That was not what news people did at that time.

JF: Uh, the Binghams owned the facilities at that time. Did you have any association with the Binghams.KS: Oh. Oh, yes.

JF: Oh, tell me about this.

KS: It was uh, forgive me my voice is a little on the raspy side. I'm getting over a, you know, one the Ohio Valley things, so so forgive me. But, yes, it was early on in my career. No. I'll tell you what. I'm going to go back to my interview.

JF: Okay.

KS: I forgotten about this. At 8:30 in the morning. Oh man, how could I possibly have forgotten this. This makes this story even more bazaar. George picked me up at the airport, drove me back to HAS. We came in through the back lobby. I'm walking down the hall, and I am talking to George on my left side. We are to take a corner to my right and walk into the news room. So I'm concentrating on 60:00George trying to impress him greatly, and not paying any attention about making a turn around the corner to the right. Anyway, I talking to George, talking to George, make the turn and run smack, face-to-face body on body contact with Barry Bingham, Jr.

JF: (laughs)

KS: I mean to a point where I mean you're wrapped, I mean---

JF: Yeah.

KS: ---you ran into him and literally wrapped your arms around him because he was just there, and the forward momentum carried you.

JF: Wow.

KS: Here is this this very dapper individual with the handlebar mustache. He's wearing a trench coat, and he's just sitting there, and I mean, "Oh, I'm sorry sir, forgive me."

And he's just like, "No, that's not your fault. No." The nicest guy in the 61:00world---George has his jaw open like you do. He's sitting there with his mouth wide open. And, you know, I'm sorry. What are you doing here? This is Barry Bingham, Jr. "What are you doing here?"

I said, "Well, I'm I'm you know, I'm in an interview, and they are looking to hire a meteorologist for the morning and for Saturday night on tv."

"Well, best of luck to you."

JF: You didn't know who he was. Even the name didn't mean anything to you.

KS: He, he said, "Hey I'm Barry."

"Hi, I'm Ken." And so we part and we walk into the news room, and George still has his jaw open, and says, "Do you know who that is?"

I said, "Barry."

He said, "He owns this block." (both laugh)

JF: Should have been a tip for the day, Ken. It should have been a tip for the day---how the day was going to go.

KS: You know what he was doing there. He was learning the business.

JF: I'll be darn.

KS: Um, he is Barry Bingham, Jr., and what he wanted to do was to find out every 62:00aspect of what was going on in that building behind the Courier, and he was working in the film production---

JF: Is that right.

KS: ---room. I mean with the chemicals. That when we had actually film. That's not video tape. And so that is why he's wearing that trench coat.

JF: He's learning.

KS: He was learning. He was learning---

JF: How about that.

KS: ---how film was---

JF: So it sounds like it was the a good association with the Binghams. Even though you didn't work closely with them, but it was a good atmosphere and everything.

KS: ---six months after I'm hired, um, Barry Bingham, Jr. shows up in the tv studio. I was filling in for Chuck, one night, vacation, whatever, and here comes Barry. Now I know who he is, you know, and I'm about ready to go on the air, and he just shows up. And I was never so distracted in my life. Because here's this guy that owns this whole block. (laughs) You know, and I he says, he got a chair and sat down, and I did the weather, and it was awful. I mean I just I didn't have a whole lot of, you know, broadcast chops at that time. Had less 63:00with him sitting there; so I get done, and I am I'm sweating profusely. You know I get done, and I, you know, chat with the anchors. They go into a commercial. I have to run into the radio studio because we have a broadcast going on the radio on the same time. So, I take off. I go into the radio studio. I am sitting down. I've got my hands my head in my hands. And it might have been Burbank at the time, "What's going on?"

I said, "Oh, my God. I just did the worst tv broadcast in the history of this fine station, and Barry Bingham, Jr. was there." I've got my hands over my eyes, you know, I'm just cradling them, and I'm not paying attention to, um, Gary Burbank, and Gary all of sudden says,

"Well, Mr. Bingham. Welcome." And I look up (laughs)---

JF: Oh my God.

KS: ---Barry Bingham, Jr. had followed me into the radio station to now listen to me do the worst radio broadcast in my early career. And he was there primarily for me to say welcome. He said, "You've been here for six months. I've heard some nice things about you. I just wanted to stop by before I went home and say how delighted we are that you are working for us." And oh, now my jaw is wide open.

JF: That was nice, that's class, that was class. Yeah.

KS: Class act. Always was with me. Um, and I really enjoyed working for the Binghams. I really did. They were wonderful people to me.

JF: Yeah.

KS: And uh, like I said enjoyed that time. I thought that was special, too.

JF: Yeah.

KS: And odd that I had forgotten that part where I ran into him. Man.

JF: When it came at that six months' time, did he remember that time. (both laugh)

KS: I don't think he did. I don't think he did, but oh, ---

JF: That's great.

KS: ---that interview, like I said, set the stage. JF: You worked with Terry 65:00Meiners for a while, didn't you.

KS: Well, you know as know, as time progressed, again, a lot of third meteorologists came and went, but it was primarily Chuck and myself that worked together for twenty plus years. And then Chuck came down with cancer. He passed in '98. And, uh, at that point I was still working morning radio and doing noon tv, and they had started a morning tv program as well. So I was doing---

JF: Oh, yeah.

KS: ---oh, several hours of tv, as well as radio. So, uh, I was I was quite busy, but also very secure. Felt good about where I was at that point. I didn't have to be a New York city, or a Philadelphia. I didn't have to be there. I was Louisville was home. My kids now had been born and raised here. Then Chuck passed. And the opportunity was presented, uh, would you like to become chief 66:00meteorologist for tv, and you Know, that was another one of those this may be the only opportunity to do something like that. So, I accepted that, and and in essence even though we had morning meteorologists, uh, it started to close that position. Radio no longer hired a meteorologist by themselves. They used tv---

JF: Yeah, yeah.

KS: ---personalities. Myself, Chris Phillips, was one of the morning meteorologist. He was the one that took over after I did. Um, and so but we were all tv personalities, now. Property.

JF: You had a contract with radio, now.

KS: Yeah, so I was the only, uh, meteorologist ever employed by WHAS radio.

JF: How about that. As the sole meteorologist. How about that.

KS: But, when the opportunity came I did go to tv full time. That meant going to 67:00afternoons and evenings. That's when I got to work with Terry, and only Terry in the afternoon. And uh, and some of the folks, again, that that played off of Terry, and in our office, um, you know the Beth Andrews, and folks like that. It was a great team. And uh, oh, actually I was involved with that for about that for ten years.

JF: Yeah.

KS: Afternoon, evening drive time.

JF: And the Clear Channel owner. You were there. That was the Clear Channel ownership then.

KS: Yep.

JF: Change in ownership.

KS: Yep.

JF: Maybe a little change in difference in philosophy, and things like that.

KS: Always, but but the personalities kind of remained the same. That is what I am saying. I mean Wayne, I left. I didn't mean that when Chris Phillips came in he he was welcomed. And he became part of the family, and so it worked. I was mentioning in the afternoon, I couldn't do all the broadcasting in the afternoon because of other commitments, but we had other people in the office who were indoctrinated in that that family feel so to speak.

JF: Gary Rizzo.

KS: Gary Rizzo and, like I said, Ashley Chism, there's a name, Beth Andrews, and 68:00those who followed uh, followed her. We're all kind of indoctrinated with that same feel. This is meant to be fun as well as informational.

JF: Everybody carried it off well, didn't they?

KS: And carried it off in spite changes in management. In spite the differences and the stories above us, what we did on the ground stayed pretty much the same.

JF: Before we run out of time, do you remember some specific weather moments. Uh, let's see.

KS: (laughs) Good and bad, you mean. (both laugh) Clever.

JF: Well, let's see. I I remember we were together one time in 1985 when the radio tower blew down. You were the last words heard on that tower. Right in the middle of your forecast.

KS: It was a severe thunderstorm warning. And that's what happened. Our tower went went down in a severe thunderstorm. We had severe weather in the region, and I was broadcasting a warning when---

JF: You were, yeah.

KS: ---it's like, are we on the air. (laughs)

JF: When we went off the air, I remember a phone call a lady said, "I live out here on Flat Rock Road across from your transmitter. Do you know your tower is on the ground?"

KS: (laughs)

JF: "No, let me call somebody about that." But, yours were the last words, I think, when it went out. It was in the middle of the broadcast.

KS: That's another thing that to write in my memoirs.

JF: Yeah.

KS: I only have a page, you know. (both laugh) But but I'm looking to fill it out a little more. There is one other episode uh, why this one pops in the mind when so many could have, but I want to say it was 1990, and it was Crusade for Children. And I think we had already to the first weekend in June, at that time. Crusade was always the third weekend in May, but there is so much happening; we had the Derby and everything that preceded. Then you had elections. There was a time we had elections in May, so they decided to move the Crusade back to the first weekend in June. I don't know how many of those we had had up to nineteen; 70:00it was either 1990 or 1992. Look it up. You can. I'll let you do it. I was filling in for Gary Rizzo. He was our weekend meteorologist, and he I said, well, I can I can do this Saturday evening show because it was only six o'clock because we went to the Bomhard Theater to start the Crusade, live, from seven until whenever it went off the air Monday morning. So Gary wanted to do something that weekend. He said, "Do you mind?"

I said, "One show, one show, yeah, I can knock this out, no problem, Crusade, right". We had a huge tornado outbreak, and this was the first time that we're dealing with, okay we got tornado warnings. We generally stay on the air with 71:00tornado warnings, and you're not---you, Crusade---aren't in our studios. We are not in contact with each other. How are we going to do this. And that became quite an episode, but the moment that lead up to what was one of the moments that you remember in all your broadcast career was, I shouldn't be laughing, but it was---who was the headliner that year? Uh, B.J. Thomas was the headliner.

JF: Okay.

KS: He just started to sing "Rain Drops Keep Falling on My Head."

JF: (laughs)

KS: (singing) "Raindrops keep falling," and again there was no contact other back at the station. We could flip the switches, and we no longer can hear B.J. Thomas. Not only on your tv set, even in the Bomhard, it was whatever I was 72:00saying, and here was B.J. starting ready to wail rain drops keep falling, and I---

JF: Oh, wow.

KS: ---they they used that moment to come to me, and I said, "Well, B.J. there's a whole lot more than rain drops---

JF: (laughs)

KS: ---that's falling out there," and went into the tornado warning, I think for Clark County which---

JF: Oh, right across the river.

KS: ---that actually had to evacuate the Bomhard, and evidently B.J. was not happy with me. I guess my one claim to fame is that I ticked off B.J. Thomas (both laugh) with the tornado warning. But, I do remember that it was a very long Crusade weekend.

JF: Yeah, yeah, Rizzo don't take don't let Rizzo take a day.

KS: I I did not let him forget that, although, he like most weather folks, love to be involved in weather, so he was kind of beating himself up on that, but uh, it was like, you could have, (laughs) I would have gladly let you. But, it was a long long Crusade for Children.

JF: Well, thirty years. You got a lot, you packed a lot in and didn't know it 73:00was going to be thirty years. In fact, you didn't know it was going to happen from that first interview.

KS: We moved here, and I told Cindy in 1978, and I said we're going to be here about three years, I said so don't unpack. I meant mentally. You know it's like I suspect three, no more than four, definitely not five years, but that was all that I had planned, and uh, as we got closer to that thirtieth anniversary, she said can I unpack yet.

JF: Wow.

KS: You know, so it goes just to show you, you never know.

JF: Well, you made a big impact on the community. Still doing that at Humana. You are doing some things for Humana, now. People don't know this, but as we were setting up the interview some people came through and were looking for directions for another place in the building, and uh, he said, "Well, hi Mr. Schulz." That's five years now that you've been gone.

KS: It has been five years, and very that's very rewarding.

JF: Sure.

KS: Um, you know I did my thing. I knew my limitations. As I said I was deathly afraid of public speaking, and all of these things, I know behind this scenes, but to have somebody, and I've worked through it, you know---

JF: Yeah.

KS: ---and made enough of an impression that five years after you've left broadcasting to be still stopped and say hey, I used to listen to you every morning or watch you in the evening. Uh, yeah, you don't realize how sweet that is.

JF: Yeah, part of peoples' lives. It's been a great time. Thanks for taking the time to assist going into the Archives, and people will be listening to this for years and be laughing for years, too. And that's good.

KS: And still wondering why in the world did they ever hire this this goof.

JF: Well, we're glad they did.

KS: (laughs) I am, too.

JF: Thank you, Ken.

KS: Thank you, Jack, I appreciate it.